In message , Elysium
Fossa writes

"150mph at Cairngorm in 1986" ?

So what????????............how many people live on the summit of Cairngorm
compared to the coast of North Carolina where the hurricane hit. "Clean up
continues in much of North Carolina, Virginia and Maryland a day after
hurricane Isabel pushed through the region. Twenty-nine deaths have been
blamed on the storm. Flood waters in the Chesapeake Bay have started to
recede but power remains out to more than a million homes. Insurance
companies estimate storm-related claims will approach $1 billion."


What a ridiculous, supercillious piece of journalism.




Oh dear, were the residents of NC building with wood again. When will
folks in areas of high-risk from weather extremes use a more suitable
building material. Just note that there are American TV commercials
showing the "new building material - brick".
--
Tim
tim dot ukrm at dsl dot pipex dot com

And there is the attitude of the locals, I doubt that many of the
inhabitants of Orkney or Shetland venture outside during the height of
a storm unless they *really* have to. They know it is not a wise thing
to do. I doubt that much of the US East Coast population are quite so
aware.


I was out in the 1992? storm, the one with the silly gust in Brent,

Had to go out for a leak(no inside bog) , it was Hogmanay after all.
Had a lot of trouble getting back inside though, standing, let alone
moving was often not an option.

That was the night when a bothy was blown off Unst, with its
occupants.

I was in Wester Ross.

Richard Webb

"Michael McNeil" wrote in message
om...
"Col" wrote in message
...

197mph??
Surely not!
There is no way an Atlantic depression could sustain winds of that strength,
especially at low levels.

I could have sworn he never said that that recorded speed was for a
sustained level. There I go again failing to pay attention.

Sorry, bad choice of words on my part.
I should have course said 'gust'.

However I don't believe that 197mph gusts are possible in any low level
situation apart from hurricanes and tornadoes.

Col
--
Bolton, Lancashire.
160m asl.
http://www.reddwarfer.btinternet.co.uk

"Col" wrote in message ...
I believe the world record is held by Mt Rainier. (How apt) The record
is a lot less than 192 (160's I think.) I dare say there may be
someone here to correct me.

None the less it is true that hurricanes in the North Atlantic are far
more regular than their southern cousins. On the other hand the
subtropical ones have a broader target area as well as a greater
chance for doing damage.

The lower latitudes have lower lying land and smaller tidal ranges.
That is why the tides on which hurricanes travel called storm surges
and having an height similar to high tides around Britain, cause so
much damage.

Hi all,

One of the reasons that houses in parts of the southern US are made of
wood is that it is a poor area with low wages/employment. In addition,
as it gets very hot/humid in the summer and many people can't afford
air conditioning, they build houses out of wood, to remain cooler.

So it's not out of choice they build houses out of wood. Bermuda,
which was hit by Fabian seemed to suffer less property damage as the
houses are generally well-built.

Similarly, we see less structural damage in our severe storms in the
UK due to the fairly high building standards. If you actually look at
how much damage was caused by the 1987 storm, not including houses
damaged by trees, or caravans/mobile home damage, I suspect it will be
fairly low.

cheers,

Paul K.


"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message .1...

Also the US has a habit of building with planks and nails rather than
stone. The former explodes rather more easyly than a stone built
cottage.

And there is the attitude of the locals, I doubt that many of the
inhabitants of Orkney or Shetland venture outside during the height of
a storm unless they *really* have to. They know it is not a wise thing
to do. I doubt that much of the US East Coast population are quite so
aware.

(Paul Knightley) wrote in message . com...

One of the reasons that houses in parts of the southern US are made of
wood is that it is a poor area with low wages/employment. In addition,
as it gets very hot/humid in the summer and many people can't afford
air conditioning, they build houses out of wood, to remain cooler.

The ancient houses in the north of scotland were corbelled. This is a
very strong structure and it also incorporates a degree of high tech
aerodynamics of the sort that was lost until after some chimneys were
knocked down in a power station a few decades back.

As for timber construction, if it were to the standards required by
local bye-laws set up by architectural and safety departments the
houses would be adequate for the weather they are likely to meet.

Unfortunately with pricework and modern building techniques allowing
short measure to be used so easily, most wooden houses are put
together with too few nails. For, whereas a pair of 3 or 4 inch nails
hammered home is considered adequate, nail guns use hard, easily
shattered nails so that 3, 4 or even 5 nails should be used. Quite
often only one is used.

One or two put in with nail guns would be adequate in calm weather but
when a big storm comes....

Take a look at wooden pallets. Where each section is nailed, five
nails are used and the slats are virtually inseperable. You can't pry
them apart with a two foot bar without breaking the timber. If such
were the way timber housing was assembled they would not fall apart
but shatter. No wind is that strong is it?

In article ,
(Michael McNeil) wrote:

(Paul Knightley) wrote in message
. com...

One of the reasons that houses in parts of the southern US are made of
wood is that it is a poor area with low wages/employment. In addition,
as it gets very hot/humid in the summer and many people can't afford
air conditioning, they build houses out of wood, to remain cooler.

The ancient houses in the north of scotland were corbelled. This is a
very strong structure and it also incorporates a degree of high tech
aerodynamics of the sort that was lost until after some chimneys were
knocked down in a power station a few decades back.

As for timber construction, if it were to the standards required by
local bye-laws set up by architectural and safety departments the
houses would be adequate for the weather they are likely to meet.

Unfortunately with pricework and modern building techniques allowing
short measure to be used so easily, most wooden houses are put
together with too few nails. For, whereas a pair of 3 or 4 inch nails
hammered home is considered adequate, nail guns use hard, easily
shattered nails so that 3, 4 or even 5 nails should be used. Quite
often only one is used.

One or two put in with nail guns would be adequate in calm weather but
when a big storm comes....

Take a look at wooden pallets. Where each section is nailed, five
nails are used and the slats are virtually inseperable. You can't pry
them apart with a two foot bar without breaking the timber. If such
were the way timber housing was assembled they would not fall apart
but shatter. No wind is that strong is it?

Sure it is. It's not the number of nails, it's the direction they're
driven. The problem is typically the attachment of walls to the roof.
If the base plate for the roof is nailed vertically into the wall slats,
it can be lifted off pretty easily. Hurricane clips fasten to the wall
and roof members, so the nails are driven horizontally. Failure
requires ~10X higher forces for the horizontal nails. Multiple vertical
nails wouldn't add very much.

Harold

--
Harold Brooks
Head, Mesoscale Applications Group
NOAA/National Severe Storms Laboratory, Norman, OK

Dave Ludlow wrote in message . ..

But it *was* extreme compared to what we get in heavily populated
areas of the UK and most advanced Western countries. TV likes to show
live coverage, an opportunity it rarely if ever gets in the
disaster-prone Third World - or in Bermuda for that matter (Fabian). I
am sure they would show "live" Bangladeshi Typhoons...if they could.

TV companies may be misguided for putting reporters and crew at risk
but nevertheless, for me, it was fascinating to watch the live
coverage from within Isabel on Fox news and CNN. To witness such
scenes in broad daylight is also quite unusual. It makes you realise
just why, sadly, people do get killed and injured in such conditions.

The people that put their lives at risk deserved their Darwins. The
people who died in the UK storm were taken unaware. Actually it is not
unlikely that Mr Fish saved quite a few lives since those killed in
the US were fully prepared and probably experienced not just well
informed.

The number of fools that would have gone out to play in 1987 had there
been a warning of it, would have been a lot higher as the people in
southern UK are not particularly au fait with windy weather. The death
toll would have approached the hundreds.