Typical British luck! The World warms by 2c, yet Britian, and particularly Scotland still ends up colder!

On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 13:08:42 -0700 (PDT), Dave
wrote:

Nick, watching today's news, it seems like a New Ice Age is on its way to Scotland first!
http://youtu.be/vuirnxRD1og

....and I have the figures to prove it!

--
Alan White
Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
By Loch Long, twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, Scotland.
Webcam and weather:- http://windycroft.co.uk/weather

On Tuesday, 11 August 2015 20:14:58 UTC+1, Dawlish wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 6:16:39 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Tuesday, 11 August 2015 12:45:34 UTC+1, Dawlish wrote:

I monitored the jet stream for a few months........

Idiot.

Dammit, the bully's still here then. Can someone email me when he's buggered off?

Cheers
Richard

Don't worry. I will. I'm well-used to group attempts to bully and they **never** work. Ask the ones on here who have tried. Bullies can never work on their own, can they?

Ooh, I dunno - you seem to have managed it quite successfully for years, here and elsewhere. This thread is a good example - nothing rude or personal until you stuck your oar in. There are so many threads like it, too.

Tudor Hughes, the group curmudgeon (and racist), Warlingham, Surrey.

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 3:16:11 PM UTC+1, Dawlish wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 2:11:41 PM UTC+1, wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 12:45:34 PM UTC+1, Dawlish wrote:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 12:37:59 PM UTC+1, Alastair wrote:
"xmetman" wrote in message
...

I'm sure that the phrase "jet stream" will be cropping in many conversations
about the weather in the coming years, you can easily picture one old dear
saying to another in a bus queue "I know Enid the weather has been simply
terrible, and you know it's all down to the orientation of the Jet stream
over Iceland you know".

=========================


I monitored the jet stream for a few months........

Idiot.

Why does monitoring the jet stream make him an idiot?

Col

From the science he has shown in the last week, regarding thermodynamics and centrifugal force, I would not be surprised if 'monitoring the jet stream' meant playing in the local beck with his toys.

There really are idiots, Col and this one is one.

So just because he says one thing that you disagree with, it means that everything he says must be idiotic?
That makes no sense whatsoever.

Col

On 11/08/2015 22:55, Freddie wrote:
Dawlish Wrote in message:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 12:37:59 PM UTC+1, Alastair wrote:
"xmetman" wrote in message
...


Idiot.
Why?

------------------------------------------------
He isn't, but I think from a neutral point of view I would like to know
what aspects of a the jet stream were monitored. It is a complex thing
after all. Just as "... till the models show 80% consistency" is too
broad a statement and could mean anything - but then I wouldn't respond
"idiot" to that either although some might, oh hang on ..... that
wouldn't really work ;-).
Dave

On 11/08/2015 12:43, Martin Brown wrote:
On 11/08/2015 10:35, xmetman wrote:
After listening to Carole Kirkwood talking about what a wet and cold
summer its been over Scotland
this year on this mornings Breakfast Weather, it does seem to me that
as far as the media are concerned
most of today's weather woes in this country today, including this
one can be blamed on the jet stream,
or lack of jet stream, or the position of the jet stream.

They tend to over simplify. Jet stream location and strength is mostly
of interest to commercial airline operators and optical astronomers.

So if the answer to most of the world's climate problems is the
ubiquitous "jet stream", what about its
part in global warming? I haven't seen any research that looks into
the role jet streams play in global warming,
but I'm sure it won't be long before there is a slew of scientific
papers about it.

You could always try feeding suitable terms into a search engine. eg.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...ore-pollution/


Or for the wet summer of 2012 also blamed in part on the jet stream:

http://blog.metoffice.gov.uk/2012/07...limate-change/


If this is true, just what controls the position and strength of the
jet stream, and the answer
to that must be the general atmospheric circulation, but of course
that's not half as catchy,
dynamic or sexy as the phrase "jet stream". I just can't imagine John
Hammond for instance spending
an hour in a BBC Horizon program to explain the intricacies of the
Hadley cell and the northeast trade winds,
when he can talk over a 3D animation and fly through of a North
Atlantic super jet blowing at 250 knots.

I think they *have* done stuff on the trade winds and roaring forties a
lot more often than you give them credit for.

I'm sure that the phrase "jet stream" will be cropping in many
conversations about the weather in the coming years,
you can easily picture one old dear saying to another in a bus queue
"I know Enid the weather has been simply terrible,
and you know it's all down to the orientation of the Jet stream over
Iceland you know".

It might even be true.

It seems that when the jet stream takes to meandering around it can trap
weather in a nearly static configuration over the UK.

------------------------------------------------------------
The most genuine answer would probably be a QI response of "Nobody knows" !
Dave

On Wednesday, August 12, 2015 at 1:14:51 PM UTC+1, Dave Cornwell wrote:
On 11/08/2015 22:55, Freddie wrote:
Dawlish Wrote in message:
On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 12:37:59 PM UTC+1, Alastair wrote:
"xmetman" wrote in message
...


Idiot.
Why?

------------------------------------------------
He isn't, but I think from a neutral point of view I would like to know
what aspects of a the jet stream were monitored. It is a complex thing
after all. Just as "... till the models show 80% consistency" is too
broad a statement and could mean anything - but then I wouldn't respond
"idiot" to that either although some might, oh hang on ..... that
wouldn't really work ;-).
Dave

Anyone who believes in 'cold radiation' and thinks that centrifugal force exists is a scientific idiot. The mere idea of this one 'monitoring the jet stream' makes me laugh out loud. *)) Sorry if that doesn't go down well, but after his prognostications recently, He's an idiot to me, when he talks about anything scientific.

On Wednesday, 12 August 2015 14:58:59 UTC+1, Dawlish wrote:

Anyone who believes in 'cold radiation' and thinks that centrifugal force exists is a scientific idiot. The mere idea of this one 'monitoring the jet stream' makes me laugh out loud. *)) Sorry if that doesn't go down well, but after his prognostications recently, He's an idiot to me, when he talks about anything scientific.

The warm glow of your personality envelops us all in our co-operative quest for knowledge. Long may it continue!

Tudor Hughes, Warlingham, Surrey.

"Tudor Hughes" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 12 August 2015 14:58:59 UTC+1, Dawlish wrote:

Anyone who believes in 'cold radiation' and thinks that centrifugal force
exists is a scientific idiot. The mere idea of this one 'monitoring the
jet stream' makes me laugh out loud. *)) Sorry if that doesn't go down
well, but after his prognostications recently, He's an idiot to me, when
he talks about anything scientific.

The warm glow of your personality envelops us all in our co-operative
quest for knowledge. Long may it continue!
=========

Good try hughes :-) But it won't work, his skin is made of teflon coated in
teflon :-)

Will
--
http://www.lyneside.demon.co.uk/Hayt...antage_Pro.htm
Will Hand (Haytor, Devon, 1017 feet asl)
---------------------------------------------

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 at 5:35:02 AM UTC-4, xmetman wrote:
After listening to Carole Kirkwood talking about what a wet and cold summer its been over Scotland this year on this mornings Breakfast Weather, it does seem to me that as far as the media are concerned most of today's weather woes in this country today, including this one can be blamed on the jet stream, or lack of jet stream, or the position of the jet stream. So if the answer to most of the world's climate problems is the ubiquitous "jet stream", what about its part in global warming? I haven't seen any research that looks into the role jet streams play in global warming, but I'm sure it won't be long before there is a slew of scientific papers about it.

If this is true, just what controls the position and strength of the jet stream, and the answer to that must be the general atmospheric circulation, but of course that's not half as catchy, dynamic or sexy as the phrase "jet stream". I just can't imagine John Hammond for instance spending an hour in a BBC Horizon program to explain the intricacies of the Hadley cell and the northeast trade winds, when he can talk over a 3D animation and fly through of a North Atlantic super jet blowing at 250 knots.

I'm sure that the phrase "jet stream" will be cropping in many conversations about the weather in the coming years, you can easily picture one old dear saying to another in a bus queue "I know Enid the weather has been simply terrible, and you know it's all down to the orientation of the Jet stream over Iceland you know".

=============

It's not so much what affect a fundamentally changed jet stream would have on global warming, although feedback mechanisms are no doubt set in train. The effect of a weaker and meridionally exaggerated jet stream would be in the distribution of heat and cold rather than net warming or cooling. Contrarily, it's the warming that might impact the jet stream. Arctic warming being more rapid than elsewhere, the argument goes that the thermal gradient north to south would lessen and thus reduce atmospheric zonality.

As others have pointed out, it is posited that this could result in greater-amplitude Rossby waves and a greater frequency of blocked patterns - thus also of extended periods of weather types, or more severe local or regional conditions. Jennifer Francis at Rutgers has done a lot of research in this area and there was a 2013 workshop that explored this: The Committee on Linkages Between Arctic Sea Ice Loss and Mid-Latitude Weather.

I'm not yet thoroughly convinced, and there are many inter-annual and inter- and intra-seasonal forcings to consider - no doubt including some "unknown unknowns".

Stephen.