http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...mandments.aspx
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9GIN7J6BnU [climate]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIjQR1VQA-U [crisis]

December 22, 2009, 11:00:00 | NP Editor
Canada's Fraser Institute has produced a series of videos questioning the honesty of claims made by
the climate change industry.

The videos include Climate is Constantly Changing, which breaks the lid off the little-known fact
that the earth has gone through extended temperature shifts forever, even before cars were
invented, meaning "It's not your fault" ... no matter what Al Gore wants you to believe.

A second video, Manufacturing an Environmental Crisis, outlines the environmental movement's
history of inventing and exaggerating scare campaigns.

The most recent, Confess Your Environmental Sins, looks at the success the green movement has had
in using intensive messages of guilt (similar to some religions we could think of) as a tool to
enforce its commandments on true believers. Watch it here : [video]

Eric Gisin wrote:
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...mandments.aspx

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9GIN7J6BnU [climate]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIjQR1VQA-U [crisis]

December 22, 2009, 11:00:00 | NP Editor
Canada's Fraser Institute has produced a series of videos questioning
the honesty of claims made by
the climate change industry.

The videos include Climate is Constantly Changing, which breaks the lid
off the little-known fact
that the earth has gone through extended temperature shifts forever,
even before cars were
invented, meaning "It's not your fault" ... no matter what Al Gore wants
you to believe.

A second video, Manufacturing an Environmental Crisis, outlines the
environmental movement's
history of inventing and exaggerating scare campaigns.

The most recent, Confess Your Environmental Sins, looks at the success
the green movement has had
in using intensive messages of guilt (similar to some religions we could
think of) as a tool to
enforce its commandments on true believers. Watch it here : [video]

Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true. What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs. It costs much less to adapt to change when it occurs
at a manageable rate. As change progresses some economies will be
seriously harmed (some already are) while new economies are made
possible. If change happens faster than our ability to adapt to it, it's
going to get mighty expensive and costly. I've lost $500,000 worth of
marketable pine to insects that are normally kept in check by cold
winters. Where I live we haven't gotten that kind of cold for well over
a decade, so the population of beetle exploded and killed all my pine.
That's what climate change has cost little ol' me so far... about half a
million smackers... my retirement kitty. Fortunately, I have other
options of supporting myself. When people actually start to experience
financial loss and economic damage from climate change only then will
they be convinced. You will be convinced, eventually, and it will be a
truly regrettable moment for you (and your kids and their kids too).

On Dec 22, 7:04*pm, Chom Noamsky wrote:
Eric Gisin wrote:
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...chive/2009/12/...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9GIN7J6BnU[climate]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIjQR1VQA-U[crisis]

December 22, 2009, 11:00:00 | NP Editor
Canada's Fraser Institute has produced a series of videos questioning
the honesty of claims made by
the climate change industry.

The videos include Climate is Constantly Changing, which breaks the lid
off the little-known fact
that the earth has gone through extended temperature shifts forever,
even before cars were
invented, meaning "It's not your fault" ... no matter what Al Gore wants
you to believe.

A second video, Manufacturing an Environmental Crisis, outlines the
environmental movement's
history of inventing and exaggerating scare campaigns.

The most recent, Confess Your Environmental Sins, looks at the success
the green movement has had
in using intensive messages of guilt (similar to some religions we could
think of) as a tool to
enforce its commandments on true believers. *Watch it here : [video]

Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true. *What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs. It costs much less to adapt to change when it occurs
at a manageable rate. *As change progresses some economies will be
seriously harmed (some already are) while new economies are made
possible. If change happens faster than our ability to adapt to it, it's
going to get mighty expensive and costly. *I've lost $500,000 worth of
marketable pine to insects that are normally kept in check by cold
winters. *Where I live we haven't gotten that kind of cold for well over
a decade, so the population of beetle exploded and killed all my pine.
That's what climate change has cost little ol' me so far... about half a
million smackers... my retirement kitty. *Fortunately, I have other
options of supporting myself. *When people actually start to experience
financial loss and economic damage from climate change only then will
they be convinced. *You will be convinced, eventually, and it will be a
truly regrettable moment for you (and your kids and their kids too).- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Lie......
The Alarmists still telling lies....

We went into and out of the Roman Warm Period, The
Mediæval Warm Period and the Little Ice Age with about the same speed
as now...
As a matter of fact, we just started coming out of the LIA about
1850, so we should expect to warm up.
And one degree or so in a century and a half is not fast.

How do you explain times in the past when climate changed as much
as ten degrees in a decade or two ? (What is referred to as Abrupt
Climate Change.)

On Dec 22, 7:04*pm, Chom Noamsky wrote:
Eric Gisin wrote:
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...chive/2009/12/...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9GIN7J6BnU[climate]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIjQR1VQA-U[crisis]

December 22, 2009, 11:00:00 | NP Editor
Canada's Fraser Institute has produced a series of videos questioning
the honesty of claims made by
the climate change industry.

The videos include Climate is Constantly Changing, which breaks the lid
off the little-known fact
that the earth has gone through extended temperature shifts forever,
even before cars were
invented, meaning "It's not your fault" ... no matter what Al Gore wants
you to believe.

A second video, Manufacturing an Environmental Crisis, outlines the
environmental movement's
history of inventing and exaggerating scare campaigns.

The most recent, Confess Your Environmental Sins, looks at the success
the green movement has had
in using intensive messages of guilt (similar to some religions we could
think of) as a tool to
enforce its commandments on true believers. *Watch it here : [video]

Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true. *What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs. It costs much less to adapt to change when it occurs
at a manageable rate. *As change progresses some economies will be
seriously harmed (some already are) while new economies are made
possible. If change happens faster than our ability to adapt to it, it's
going to get mighty expensive and costly. *I've lost $500,000 worth of
marketable pine to insects that are normally kept in check by cold
winters. *Where I live we haven't gotten that kind of cold for well over
a decade, so the population of beetle exploded and killed all my pine.
That's what climate change has cost little ol' me so far... about half a
million smackers... my retirement kitty. *Fortunately, I have other
options of supporting myself. *When people actually start to experience
financial loss and economic damage from climate change only then will
they be convinced. *You will be convinced, eventually, and it will be a
truly regrettable moment for you (and your kids and their kids too).- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Guess you haven't read all the reasons for the pine beetle
problem......

There is a whole list..... check our archives here in this very
group.

Also... Google is your friend....

But then... for some of you guys... anything wrong in the world is
the fault of Man-made Gorebull Warming...

A complete list of things caused by global warming...
http://www.numberwatch.co.uk/warmlist.htm (a number of links
are dead)

Chom Noamsky wrote

Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true. What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs. It costs much less to adapt to change when it occurs
at a manageable rate. As change progresses some economies will be
seriously harmed (some already are) while new economies are made
possible. If change happens faster than our ability to adapt to it, it's
going to get mighty expensive and costly. I've lost $500,000 worth of
marketable pine to insects that are normally kept in check by cold
winters. Where I live we haven't gotten that kind of cold for well over
a decade, so the population of beetle exploded and killed all my pine.
That's what climate change has cost little ol' me so far... about half a
million smackers... my retirement kitty. Fortunately, I have other
options of supporting myself. When people actually start to experience
financial loss and economic damage from climate change only then will
they be convinced. You will be convinced, eventually, and it will be a
truly regrettable moment for you (and your kids and their kids too).



The Canadian media used to refer to the Fraser Institute as "The Fraser
Institute". But the way their "studies" worked backfired on them.

They start with a conclusion and work their way in reverse to substantiate it,
avoiding all respected knowledge that may be in the way.

Science doesn't work that way.

The fact that some blowhard says that "two guys in an Oregon Quonset Hut have
a petition saying that 32,000 "scientists" say No! Doesn't hold under
scriuteny.

Now? The (evil, anti-right wing conspiracy cabal) Main Stream Media in Canada
refers to the Fraser Institute as a "Right Wing Think Tank".

And for good reason. Even the corporate owned media thinks that they're a
bunch of partisan, on the payroll punch bunnies with the credibility of CATO,
The Heritage Institute and just about every other incorrigable jackass
collection of narrow minded jerks backed by the ones whose special interests
lie in the denial industry. Many of whom were 100% behind the 7 top tobacco
executives in 1994 when they claimed under oath to the US congress that
"tobacco and nicotine are not addictive".

As Ann Coulter once said:

"Consider the source"


The only time I've ever agreed with her. But It's not as if I never did
anyway.

Pete wrote:
Chom Noamsky wrote
Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true. What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs. It costs much less to adapt to change when it occurs
at a manageable rate. As change progresses some economies will be
seriously harmed (some already are) while new economies are made
possible. If change happens faster than our ability to adapt to it, it's
going to get mighty expensive and costly. I've lost $500,000 worth of
marketable pine to insects that are normally kept in check by cold
winters. Where I live we haven't gotten that kind of cold for well over
a decade, so the population of beetle exploded and killed all my pine.
That's what climate change has cost little ol' me so far... about half a
million smackers... my retirement kitty. Fortunately, I have other
options of supporting myself. When people actually start to experience
financial loss and economic damage from climate change only then will
they be convinced. You will be convinced, eventually, and it will be a
truly regrettable moment for you (and your kids and their kids too).



The Canadian media used to refer to the Fraser Institute as "The Fraser
Institute". But the way their "studies" worked backfired on them.

They start with a conclusion and work their way in reverse to substantiate it,
avoiding all respected knowledge that may be in the way.

Science doesn't work that way.

The fact that some blowhard says that "two guys in an Oregon Quonset Hut have
a petition saying that 32,000 "scientists" say No! Doesn't hold under
scriuteny.

Now? The (evil, anti-right wing conspiracy cabal) Main Stream Media in Canada
refers to the Fraser Institute as a "Right Wing Think Tank".

And for good reason. Even the corporate owned media thinks that they're a
bunch of partisan, on the payroll punch bunnies with the credibility of CATO,
The Heritage Institute and just about every other incorrigable jackass
collection of narrow minded jerks backed by the ones whose special interests
lie in the denial industry. Many of whom were 100% behind the 7 top tobacco
executives in 1994 when they claimed under oath to the US congress that
"tobacco and nicotine are not addictive".

As Ann Coulter once said:

"Consider the source"


The only time I've ever agreed with her. But It's not as if I never did
anyway.

The philosophy of the FI is all about economic freedom, no matter what
the social or environmental costs are. When one person's freedom comes
at the expense of others it's a false freedom... the FI is essentially a
promoter of false freedoms.

To be fair, once in a while it produces something that actually makes sense.

Peter Muehlbauer wrote

This shows all but a fast acceleration.
Quite the opposite, this is a relative slow increasing slope compared to those
before.
Sorry, you have to find some better arguments.



Can you cite that from a more reliable source than a privately owned website
on the Internet?

Or do you consider traditional sources from peer reviewed notions unreliable
to support your arguement?

Chom Noamsky wrote

Pete wrote:
Chom Noamsky wrote
Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true. What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs. It costs much less to adapt to change when it occurs
at a manageable rate. As change progresses some economies will be
seriously harmed (some already are) while new economies are made
possible. If change happens faster than our ability to adapt to it, it's
going to get mighty expensive and costly. I've lost $500,000 worth of
marketable pine to insects that are normally kept in check by cold
winters. Where I live we haven't gotten that kind of cold for well over
a decade, so the population of beetle exploded and killed all my pine.
That's what climate change has cost little ol' me so far... about half a
million smackers... my retirement kitty. Fortunately, I have other
options of supporting myself. When people actually start to experience
financial loss and economic damage from climate change only then will
they be convinced. You will be convinced, eventually, and it will be a
truly regrettable moment for you (and your kids and their kids too).



The Canadian media used to refer to the Fraser Institute as "The Fraser
Institute". But the way their "studies" worked backfired on them.

They start with a conclusion and work their way in reverse to substantiate it,
avoiding all respected knowledge that may be in the way.

Science doesn't work that way.

The fact that some blowhard says that "two guys in an Oregon Quonset Hut have
a petition saying that 32,000 "scientists" say No! Doesn't hold under
scriuteny.

Now? The (evil, anti-right wing conspiracy cabal) Main Stream Media in Canada
refers to the Fraser Institute as a "Right Wing Think Tank".

And for good reason. Even the corporate owned media thinks that they're a
bunch of partisan, on the payroll punch bunnies with the credibility of CATO,
The Heritage Institute and just about every other incorrigable jackass
collection of narrow minded jerks backed by the ones whose special interests
lie in the denial industry. Many of whom were 100% behind the 7 top tobacco
executives in 1994 when they claimed under oath to the US congress that
"tobacco and nicotine are not addictive".

As Ann Coulter once said:

"Consider the source"


The only time I've ever agreed with her. But It's not as if I never did
anyway.

The philosophy of the FI is all about economic freedom, no matter what
the social or environmental costs are. When one person's freedom comes
at the expense of others it's a false freedom... the FI is essentially a
promoter of false freedoms.

To be fair, once in a while it produces something that actually makes sense.

The cost of taxes "tax freedom day" in Canada was a pile of unmitigated hooey.

It's really in May, not July.

But! It still gets press in July, by all the media!

On the other hand, some think that Elvis is working at a burger joint in
Kalamazoo, and he's 79 now so he should consider revealing himself and
retiring!

"There's a guy down at the Chip Shop who swears he's Elvis"

- Kristy MacColl

-

Peter Muehlbauer wrote:
Chom Noamsky wrote:

Eric Gisin wrote:
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...mandments.aspx

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9GIN7J6BnU [climate]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIjQR1VQA-U [crisis]

December 22, 2009, 11:00:00 | NP Editor
Canada's Fraser Institute has produced a series of videos questioning
the honesty of claims made by
the climate change industry.

The videos include Climate is Constantly Changing, which breaks the lid
off the little-known fact
that the earth has gone through extended temperature shifts forever,
even before cars were
invented, meaning "It's not your fault" ... no matter what Al Gore wants
you to believe.

A second video, Manufacturing an Environmental Crisis, outlines the
environmental movement's
history of inventing and exaggerating scare campaigns.

The most recent, Confess Your Environmental Sins, looks at the success
the green movement has had
in using intensive messages of guilt (similar to some religions we could
think of) as a tool to
enforce its commandments on true believers. Watch it here : [video]
Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true.

Full ACK

What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs.

http://sceptics.umweltluege.de/vostok/vtrendz.png

This shows all but a fast acceleration.
Quite the opposite, this is a relative slow increasing slope compared to those
before.
Sorry, you have to find some better arguments.

Explain something to me: how is it the science behind this graph 100%
gospel truth while all other science supportive of AGW is a lie? I
don't doubt the veracity of the graph and I sincerely hope the
conclusions drawn from it are correct. However, I'm sick of all the
selectiveness and cherry picking.

Catoni wrote:
On Dec 22, 7:04 pm, Chom Noamsky wrote:
Eric Gisin wrote:
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/b...chive/2009/12/...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9GIN7J6BnU[climate]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIjQR1VQA-U[crisis]
December 22, 2009, 11:00:00 | NP Editor
Canada's Fraser Institute has produced a series of videos questioning
the honesty of claims made by
the climate change industry.
The videos include Climate is Constantly Changing, which breaks the lid
off the little-known fact
that the earth has gone through extended temperature shifts forever,
even before cars were
invented, meaning "It's not your fault" ... no matter what Al Gore wants
you to believe.
A second video, Manufacturing an Environmental Crisis, outlines the
environmental movement's
history of inventing and exaggerating scare campaigns.
The most recent, Confess Your Environmental Sins, looks at the success
the green movement has had
in using intensive messages of guilt (similar to some religions we could
think of) as a tool to
enforce its commandments on true believers. Watch it here : [video]
Climate change is a natural cyclical phenomena, that is absolutely 100%
true. What isn't natural is accelerating how fast it occurs, and let's
be honest, the biggest concern isn't climate change itself but how
rapidly it occurs. It costs much less to adapt to change when it occurs
at a manageable rate. As change progresses some economies will be
seriously harmed (some already are) while new economies are made
possible. If change happens faster than our ability to adapt to it, it's
going to get mighty expensive and costly. I've lost $500,000 worth of
marketable pine to insects that are normally kept in check by cold
winters. Where I live we haven't gotten that kind of cold for well over
a decade, so the population of beetle exploded and killed all my pine.
That's what climate change has cost little ol' me so far... about half a
million smackers... my retirement kitty. Fortunately, I have other
options of supporting myself. When people actually start to experience
financial loss and economic damage from climate change only then will
they be convinced. You will be convinced, eventually, and it will be a
truly regrettable moment for you (and your kids and their kids too).- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Guess you haven't read all the reasons for the pine beetle
problem......

There is a whole list..... check our archives here in this very
group.

Also... Google is your friend....

But then... for some of you guys... anything wrong in the world is
the fault of Man-made Gorebull Warming...

A complete list of things caused by global warming...
http://www.numberwatch.co.uk/warmlist.htm (a number of links
are dead)

I'd wager that you pray to Jesus every Sunday and there is no proof he
ever existed. Did I tell you about my local ski hill? Still closed, it
opened one winter out of the last 20. Two negative impacts on my life
directly linked to climate change and you want me to take you SERIOUSLY?