Do I detect a slight cooling in the air?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...rature-cooling

On Sep 17, 10:45*am, "Alan Murphy" wrote:
Do I detect a slight cooling in the air?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...9/sep/16/globa...

Hi Alan. Thanks for that. It's actually a good article, the basic gist
of which I agree with. Last year, the Hadley Centre released a
prediction from their own model saying that GW may stall for few years
before picking up again. Neither Latif's model, not the Hadley
Centre's model says that GW is at an end because of graphs that start
at the peak of the largest El Nino of modern times in 1998.

On 17 Sep, 18:24, Dawlish wrote:
On Sep 17, 10:45*am, "Alan Murphy" wrote:

Do I detect a slight cooling in the air?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...9/sep/16/globa...

Hi Alan. Thanks for that. It's actually a good article, the basic gist
of which I agree with. Last year, the Hadley Centre released a
prediction from their own model saying that GW may stall for few years
before picking up again. Neither Latif's model, not the Hadley
Centre's model says that GW is at an end because of graphs that start
at the peak of the largest El Nino of modern times in 1998.

If this is correct then we have quite a few years before
'catastrophic' global warming occurs. We have a whole new generation
of young children being brainwashed in schools to believe that man
made global warming is a 'fact'. These children will become adults and
will accept that man must not pollute the planet and try to reduce CO2
emissions. In itself a good thing. Up until then it's about time that
the current generation of adults realise that vested interests are
running the agenda. People like Gore are making millions out of
'global warming'. Politicians should start to think about the policies
they sign up to. These children will grow up into a world that has
been destroyed not by global warming but by ill thought out ideas by
'do-gooders' , greens and greedy politicians.

On Sep 17, 7:10*pm, Pete L wrote:
On 17 Sep, 18:24, Dawlish wrote:

On Sep 17, 10:45*am, "Alan Murphy" wrote:

Do I detect a slight cooling in the air?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...9/sep/16/globa....

Hi Alan. Thanks for that. It's actually a good article, the basic gist
of which I agree with. Last year, the Hadley Centre released a
prediction from their own model saying that GW may stall for few years
before picking up again. Neither Latif's model, not the Hadley
Centre's model says that GW is at an end because of graphs that start
at the peak of the largest El Nino of modern times in 1998.

If this is correct then we have quite a few years before
'catastrophic' global warming occurs. We have a whole new generation
of young children being brainwashed in schools to believe that man
made global warming is a 'fact'. These children will become adults and
will accept that man must not pollute the planet and try to reduce CO2
emissions. In itself a good thing. Up until then it's about time that
the current generation of adults realise that vested interests are
running the agenda. People like Gore are making millions out of
'global warming'. Politicians should start to think about the policies
they sign up to. These children will grow up into a world that has
been destroyed not by global warming but by ill thought out ideas by
'do-gooders' , greens and greedy politicians.

No agenda there then. That's just a rant.

Like I said, neither set of scientists in the article is saying that
GW (and probably AGW) will not happen. If I had to choose which model
to believe, I'd go for the Hadley Centre's predictions, though
temperatures through the La Nina, the current solar minimum and this
El Nino are showing no signs of cooling whatsoever and one might well
expect cooling to have already happened. The Hadley Centre have more
experience and have developed their models much further, using land
based, as well as ocean temperatures in their predictions.

A generation of schoolchildren are being educated far better than ever
before about sustainability and climate change is a part of that
education. You haven't been in a classroom recently have you, or you'd
retract the "brainwashing" rubbish immediately.

It's about time that the "current generation of adults", together with
Industry and others and yes; led by the scientists and politicians,
really began to change their (our) approach to how we view the future,
as the likelihood is that we will leave our descendents enormous
problems to deal with in terms of climate change through our actions.
Sensibly, that is already beginning to happen and you and your ilk are
not being listened to, Peter. I think you and your fellow denialists
would do well to think more clearly about the climate future than you
are and base your actions on climate likelihoods and not on what you,
personally, feel will happen.

On 17 Sep, 19:10, Pete L wrote:

If this is correct then we have quite a few years before
'catastrophic' global warming occurs. We have a whole new generation
of young children being brainwashed in schools to believe that man
made global warming is a 'fact'.

As much as I believe it's happening given recent years, I can't help
wondering if 20 years down the line, all the existing climate models
are found wanting having all missed out on an important nonlinear
negative feedback that ends up actually cooling the earth system.

Richard

On Sep 17, 7:53*pm, Richard Dixon wrote:
On 17 Sep, 19:10, Pete L wrote:

If this is correct then we have quite a few years before
'catastrophic' global warming occurs. We have a whole new generation
of young children being brainwashed in schools to believe that man
made global warming is a 'fact'.

As much as I believe it's happening given recent years, I can't help
wondering if 20 years down the line, all the existing climate models
are found wanting having all missed out on an important nonlinear
negative feedback that ends up actually cooling the earth system.

Richard

The exact opposite of that could be true as well, don't forget and the
models may have missed an important non-linear positive feedback that
speeds the process and leads to warming that actually exceeds the
error bars of the various present models.

"Richard Dixon" wrote in message
...
On 17 Sep, 19:10, Pete L wrote:

If this is correct then we have quite a few years before
'catastrophic' global warming occurs. We have a whole new generation
of young children being brainwashed in schools to believe that man
made global warming is a 'fact'.

As much as I believe it's happening given recent years, I can't help
wondering if 20 years down the line, all the existing climate models
are found wanting having all missed out on an important nonlinear
negative feedback that ends up actually cooling the earth system.

Richard

The problem has ben the whole AGW issue has been hijacked by those with
ideologically led political agendas, these people in turn exaggerate every
weather event or stuff like the recent Californian fires and blame it Evil
western mens (not women) greed and profligate use of fossil fuels. All the
scare stories of killer heat waves, increased hurricanes, The Maldives
dissapearing under rising oceans and so on have so far failed to materialse.
That has icreasingly undermined the public willingness to go with tax hikes
to pay for something that has''t even remorely materialise.

As we build towards the the next big climate conference in Copenhagen all
sorts of gimmicks and stunts designed to frighten the bejesus out of people
will appear in the public domain with I may had a religious zeal fro
organisations like the BBC.

The recent scare story of the Arctic Ice disappearing has know hit an ice
berg with the latest from Jaxa
http://www.ijis.iarc.uaf.edu/en/home/seaice_extent.htm shows us that the
2009 ice now on the advance looks set to wave goodbye to the 2005 level as
as 2007 and 2008. Yet not one word in the media about this. In fact Joe B's
said something very telling in this video
http://www.accuweather.com/video-on-...ok%20at%20Fred

Where Joe at 3:36min in, makes the point that when the 2009 ice level
started to melt rapidly that many press clippings were almost rejoicing at
the ice loss, as were many others.
Now you can bet your bottom dollar that if the ice had reached 2007's levels
then we would have heard about it. You can also safely assume that if the
Antarctic ice was well below the 79-2001 average we'd hear the same that AGW
was in full swing; howevr the Antarctic ice doesn't read the Guardian and is
well above that average line
http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/i...timeseries.png

We all know there has been warming through our lifetimes but the poliitcal
activist within the AGW movement seize on every severe weather event and
dripping ice berg to prove how we have destroyed our environment for future
generations yet fail to mention what a low hurricane season it's been, how
the Arctic ice is seemingly rebounding and how the antarctic ice is steadily
growing..

In article , lawrence13
@sky.com says...
All the
scare stories of killer heat waves, increased hurricanes, The Maldives
dissapearing under rising oceans and so on have so far failed to materialse.



What worries me is that when events like the decline in arctic ice and
heatwaves and desertification and the Maldives were first mooted they
were like, in 100 years or more. It is only the measured data and
particularly the somewhat rapid decline of the Arctic Ice sheet over
these last few years that has spurned some to say "it's happening faster
than we feared". The timespans before these "disasters" were predicted
to happen have been shrinking at a rate that has these events moving
towards us faster than we have been moving towards them.

When people first started to worry about CC (or GW as it was) it wasn't
expected to affect us much in our lifetimes. As such, I think it a bit
disingenuous to ridicule them on the basis that they haven't happened
"yet"

--
Alan LeHun

"Alan LeHun" wrote in message
...
In article , lawrence13
@sky.com says...
All the
scare stories of killer heat waves, increased hurricanes, The Maldives
dissapearing under rising oceans and so on have so far failed to
materialse.



What worries me is that when events like the decline in arctic ice and
heatwaves and desertification and the Maldives were first mooted they
were like, in 100 years or more. It is only the measured data and
particularly the somewhat rapid decline of the Arctic Ice sheet over
these last few years that has spurned some to say "it's happening faster
than we feared". The timespans before these "disasters" were predicted
to happen have been shrinking at a rate that has these events moving
towards us faster than we have been moving towards them.

When people first started to worry about CC (or GW as it was) it wasn't
expected to affect us much in our lifetimes. As such, I think it a bit
disingenuous to ridicule them on the basis that they haven't happened
"yet"

--
Alan LeHun


But Alan I clearly remeber a BBC Newsnight item wher their correspondont was
actually in the Maldives claiming that the sea level would be well above
he's head in fifty years time. Now that was well over 7 years ago and it
hasn;t moved yet

Searching for the Maldives NewsNight story I found this which was telling
and amusing at the same time http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/563127.stm
This is from 1999 with Jonh Simpson warning of sea level rises threatening
the island

"Lawrence Jenkins" wrote in message
...

"Alan LeHun" wrote in message
...
In article , lawrence13
@sky.com says...
All the
scare stories of killer heat waves, increased hurricanes, The Maldives
dissapearing under rising oceans and so on have so far failed to
materialse.



What worries me is that when events like the decline in arctic ice and
heatwaves and desertification and the Maldives were first mooted they
were like, in 100 years or more. It is only the measured data and
particularly the somewhat rapid decline of the Arctic Ice sheet over
these last few years that has spurned some to say "it's happening faster
than we feared". The timespans before these "disasters" were predicted
to happen have been shrinking at a rate that has these events moving
towards us faster than we have been moving towards them.

When people first started to worry about CC (or GW as it was) it wasn't
expected to affect us much in our lifetimes. As such, I think it a bit
disingenuous to ridicule them on the basis that they haven't happened
"yet"

--
Alan LeHun


But Alan I clearly remeber a BBC Newsnight item wher their correspondont
was actually in the Maldives claiming that the sea level would be well
above he's head in fifty years time. Now that was well over 7 years ago
and it hasn;t moved yet

Searching for the Maldives NewsNight story I found this which was telling
and amusing at the same time
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/563127.stm This is from 1999 with Jonh
Simpson warning of sea level rises threatening the island

Did you see Antartica mentioned in that article too Lawrence!

Will
--