"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote in message
nk.net...
"Dave Thompson" wrote in message
...

"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Dave Thompson" wrote in message
...

In Arizona we've been under drought conditions for ten years. We got
your rain this year, almost as much as we would get in an entire year,
and it's helped to a degree with filling up our resevoirs and aquifer.

Actually, Phoenix has had more rain than Portland so far this year.

Yes, I believe it has. Kinda what I was saying. We got your rain.

Everywhere else is getting our rain.

I'm sure your ecosystem will handle it just fine, like our deserts handle
occaissional floods without rotting out. Look at tree growth rings some
time. The older ones have handled decades of droughts.

Some did--millions didn't.

2 - Just because we got all this rain should we start worrying about a
deluge and build an ark? Put it in perspective and enjoy the sunshine
for a change. You'll have plenty of gloom again.

If Phoenix/Scottsdale/Tempe has massive flooding (the drains there are
built for drought conditions, not constant rain)

You have no frigging clue what you are talking about. We've had no
flooding here this year, and we've had 7 times the rain in a few short
days than we normally have during the first part of the year. All they
had to do was open a few dams and let the excess through. BTW - the storm
drains here, unlike Portland, are built to handle large amounts of water
in a short period of time because that's what happens here. The only bad
flooding we ever had was over twenty years ago, and that's been solved.

First of all, I said IF. Second of all, are you asserting that the
possibility of floods in Phoenix doesn't exist?

and you do need to build an ark,
from where do you think the wood will originate? Sedona?

Home Depot.

And where does HD get the wood?

Asia, central america ... many places.

We have put it into perspective, and the prognosis sucks. You should
realize that even if you lived in Death Valley. Try using some
perspective yourself, Dave.

I've lived in both places. Portland over reacts to low rain. It wasn't
too long ago you were building dikes to keep the downtown from flooding.

Were you here, Dave? Downtown Portland was in real danger of flooding.
Oregon City did in fact have massive floods (businesses awash and many
ruined); the Tualatin Hills suffered from landslides--and insurance won't
cover those. And you thought we overreacted, eh?

It
might be dry and sunny there this year. Just put it in perspective: your
tomato crops will be fantastic.

Is that the only thing you think this means, Dave? A good tomato crop?

--

... Hank

http://home.earthlink.net/~horedson
http://home.earthlink.net/~w0rli

wrote in message
oups.com...

(ship)

We have put it into perspective, and the prognosis sucks. You should

realize that even if you lived in Death Valley. Try using some
perspective
yourself, Dave.


It's foolish to think we can predict extremes in climate, especially
for this area. We have no idea what kind of drought and heat Oregon has
gone through in the past 50,000 years. Everybody's flipping out and
linking the recent lack of precip with global warming. This kind of
'abnormal' weather is perfectly normal and part of the natural climate
cycle in the northwest.


We are talking about a minor change in the weather, not about
the climate, that has NOT changed at all.

--

... Hank

http://home.earthlink.net/~horedson
http://home.earthlink.net/~w0rli

"Hank Oredson" wrote in message
ink.net...

We are talking about a minor change in the weather, not about
the climate, that has NOT changed at all.

I never mentioned climate change. I mentioned drought, and that's what
bothers me. It may just be for this season; we may get an April deluge.
But right now we're looking at water shortages, crop failures, fish runs
dried up, and maybe an extra forest fire or five.

If that sort of thing bothers no one else, then we're in even worse shape.

"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote:

Nobody's whining, but we are concerned. Arizona has been a dry state
for centuries. Western Oregon has been home to thousands of acres of
old growth forests for just as long. Your state is used to drought.
Our ecosystem cannot handle this dry weather.



Sure it can! It's seen drought before.

"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote:

I'm sure your ecosystem will handle it just fine, like our deserts
handle occaissional floods without rotting out. Look at tree growth
rings some time. The older ones have handled decades of droughts.

Some did--millions didn't.


Got a cite on that?

"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote:

might be dry and sunny there this year. Just put it in perspective:
your tomato crops will be fantastic.

Is that the only thing you think this means, Dave? A good tomato
crop?



That, and a lot of entertainment from the End Is Nigh folks.

"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote:

I never mentioned climate change. I mentioned drought, and that's
what bothers me. It may just be for this season; we may get an April
deluge. But right now we're looking at water shortages, crop failures,
fish runs dried up, and maybe an extra forest fire or five.

If that sort of thing bothers no one else, then we're in even worse
shape.




Were you here for the summer of 1970? You damn near got frisked for matches
and lighters going into the woods.

"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Hank Oredson" wrote in message
ink.net...

We are talking about a minor change in the weather, not about
the climate, that has NOT changed at all.

I never mentioned climate change. I mentioned drought, and that's what
bothers me. It may just be for this season; we may get an April deluge.
But right now we're looking at water shortages, crop failures, fish runs
dried up, and maybe an extra forest fire or five.

Here is what you said:

"It's foolish to think we can predict extremes in climate, especially
for this area. We have no idea what kind of drought and heat Oregon has
gone through in the past 50,000 years. Everybody's flipping out and
linking the recent lack of precip with global warming. This kind of
'abnormal' weather is perfectly normal and part of the natural climate
cycle in the northwest."

Perhaps I did not understand you correctly.
To me "extremes in climate" means the climate changed.
If you meant "extremes in weather" then you should say so.

If that sort of thing bothers no one else, then we're in even worse shape.

Why should anyone be bothered?

--

... Hank

http://home.earthlink.net/~horedson
http://home.earthlink.net/~w0rli

Lobby Dosser wrote:
"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote:

I'm sure your ecosystem will handle it just fine, like our deserts
handle occaissional floods without rotting out. Look at tree growth
rings some time. The older ones have handled decades of droughts.

Some did--millions didn't.


Got a cite on that?

I think big, soggy, windy Pacific storms have done more forest damage in
the Northwest than droughts in historic times.

http://oregonstate.edu/~readw/January1880.html

The forests can and have withstood droughts, the biggest danger then
being lightning-caused fires, more recently augmented with stupid or
outright criminal activity by humans. Not that fires haven't been a
natural part of the ecosystem since God planted the first seed...

Bob ^,,^

"Hank Oredson" wrote in message
news
"Skip Elliott Bowman" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Hank Oredson" wrote in message
ink.net...

We are talking about a minor change in the weather, not about
the climate, that has NOT changed at all.

I never mentioned climate change. I mentioned drought, and that's what
bothers me. It may just be for this season; we may get an April deluge.
But right now we're looking at water shortages, crop failures, fish runs
dried up, and maybe an extra forest fire or five.

Here is what you said:

"It's foolish to think we can predict extremes in climate, especially
for this area. We have no idea what kind of drought and heat Oregon has
gone through in the past 50,000 years. Everybody's flipping out and
linking the recent lack of precip with global warming. This kind of
'abnormal' weather is perfectly normal and part of the natural climate
cycle in the northwest."

I didn't write that, but okay.

Perhaps I did not understand you correctly.
To me "extremes in climate" means the climate changed.
If you meant "extremes in weather" then you should say so.

Point taken--I should have written the latter.

If that sort of thing bothers no one else, then we're in even worse
shape.

Why should anyone be bothered?

There is no response for a statement like that.