wrote in message

On Nov 9, 9:36 pm, "James" wrote:
"Roger Coppock" wrote in message





Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one
predicted by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike in
global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea temperatures
rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic sultry period, known
as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO), marked a 400,000-year-
long heat wave in the midst of a long era of global cooling.

Now research published Nov. 5 in the journal Science suggests the
rise in surface sea temperature occurred during a time when
atmospheric carbon dioxide (CO2) levels were particularly high,
according to a research team from Utrecht University and the Royal
Netherlands Institute for Sea Research.

Doesn't mean co2 caused it. Especially if co2 follows temps.



First reported by U.S. scientists in 2003, the MECO warming period
has been documented by data from a smattering of sites around the
world. Our paper is among the first to show that CO2 concentrations
and the temperature varied hand in hand in that time, says Peter
Bijl, a paleoclimatologist at the Netherlands Utretcht University
and one of the paper s lead authors.

The study may help put to rest some of the doubts expressed about
today s climate models because it describes an actual warming event
rather than one predicted by a model, according to Jeff Kiehl, head
of the Climate Change Research Section at the National Center for
Atmospheric Research in Boulder, CO.

[ . . . ]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS1...oomia_ow=t0:s0...

= = = = = = = = = = = =
Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 763 - 764
DOI: 10.1126/science.1197894
Increased Atmospheric CO2 During the Middle Eocene
Paul N. Pearson
Even without humans, there are many processes that can change the
concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2) in Earth's atmosphere and
affect global climate. On page 819 of this issue, Bijl et al. (1)
provide the first direct evidence that very high CO2 levels
occurred about 40 million years ago during the Middle Eocene
Climatic Optimum (MECO), one of the hottest intervals in Earth's
climate history. The hunt is now on for a geological cause for this
event and fingers are pointing at the Himalayan mountain belt.

School of Earth and Ocean Sciences, Cardiff University, Cardiff CF10
3YE, UK.

E-mail:

The editors suggest the following Related Resources on Science
sites: In Science Magazine
REPORTS
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl, Alexander J. P. Houben, Stefan Schouten, Steven M.
Bohaty, Appy Sluijs, Gert-Jan Reichart, Jaap S. Sinninghe Damst ,
and Henk Brinkhuis (5 November 2010)
Science 330 (6005), 819. [DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654]

http://sciencemagazine.com/search.ph....com&cachekey=...



"Played a major role" -- do you need your handlers to parse that for
you?

Didn't see that phrase but regardless there is no cause and effect here.

"Dawlish" wrote in message

On Nov 10, 1:06 am, Roger Coppock wrote:
Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one predicted
by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike in
global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea temperatures
rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic sultry period, known
as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO), marked a 400,000-year-
long heat wave in the midst of a long era of global cooling.

Now research published Nov. 5 in the journal Science suggests the
rise in surface sea temperature occurred during a time when
atmospheric carbon dioxide (CO2) levels were particularly high,
according to a research team from Utrecht University and the Royal
Netherlands Institute for Sea Research.

First reported by U.S. scientists in 2003, the MECO warming period
has been documented by data from a smattering of sites around the
world. “Our paper is among the first to show that CO2 concentrations
and the temperature varied hand in hand in that time,” says Peter
Bijl, a paleoclimatologist at the Netherlands’ Utretcht University
and one of the paper’s lead authors.

The study may help put to rest some of the doubts expressed about
today’s climate models because it describes an actual warming event
rather than one predicted by a model, according to Jeff Kiehl, head
of the Climate Change Research Section at the National Center for
Atmospheric Research in Boulder, CO.

[ . . . ]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS1...oomia_ow=t0:s0...

= = = = = = = = = = = =
Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 763 - 764
DOI: 10.1126/science.1197894
Increased Atmospheric CO2 During the Middle Eocene
Paul N. Pearson
Even without humans, there are many processes that can change the
concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2) in Earth's atmosphere and
affect global climate. On page 819 of this issue, Bijl et al. (1)
provide the first direct evidence that very high CO2 levels occurred
about 40 million years ago during the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum
(MECO), one of the hottest intervals in Earth's climate history. The
hunt is now on for a geological cause for this event—and fingers are
pointing at the Himalayan mountain belt.

School of Earth and Ocean Sciences, Cardiff University, Cardiff CF10
3YE, UK.

E-mail:

The editors suggest the following Related Resources on Science sites:
In Science Magazine
REPORTS
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl, Alexander J. P. Houben, Stefan Schouten, Steven M.
Bohaty, Appy Sluijs, Gert-Jan Reichart, Jaap S. Sinninghe Damsté, and
Henk Brinkhuis (5 November 2010)
Science 330 (6005), 819. [DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654]

http://sciencemagazine.com/search.ph....com&cachekey=...

Here's the abstract; you've got to pay for the rest.

Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 819 - 821
DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654
Prev | Table of Contents | Next

Reports
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl,1,*, Alexander J. P. Houben,1,*, Stefan Schouten,2
Steven M. Bohaty,3 Appy Sluijs,1 Gert-Jan Reichart,4 Jaap S. Sinninghe
Damsté,2,4 Henk Brinkhuis1

The long-term warmth of the Eocene (~56 to 34 million years ago) is
commonly associated with elevated partial pressure of atmospheric
carbon dioxide (pCO2). However, a direct relationship between the two
has not been established for short-term climate perturbations. We
reconstructed changes in both pCO2 and temperature over an episode of
transient global warming called the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum
(MECO; ~40 million years ago). Organic molecular paleothermometry
indicates a warming of southwest Pacific sea surface temperatures
(SSTs) by 3° to 6°C. Reconstructions of pCO2 indicate a concomitant
increase by a factor of 2 to 3. The marked consistency between SST and
pCO2 trends during the MECO suggests that elevated pCO2 played a major
role in global warming during the MECO.

That's certainly got the deniers out in force to try everything they
can to deny it. mind you, it's not much.

It's really interesting research. The first time that a warming event
in the past has been attributed to CO2 without having to model its
effect. This is what patient, careful research does. It adds to the
knowledge base and it's yet another piece of research that makes
outright climate deniers just look stupid.

You are lying again. It never said that at all.

On Nov 10, 7:01*pm, "James" wrote:
"Dawlish" wrote in message







On Nov 10, 1:06 am, Roger Coppock wrote:
Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one predicted
by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike in
global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea temperatures
rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic sultry period, known
as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO), marked a 400,000-year-
long heat wave in the midst of a long era of global cooling.

Now research published Nov. 5 in the journal Science suggests the
rise in surface sea temperature occurred during a time when
atmospheric carbon dioxide (CO2) levels were particularly high,
according to a research team from Utrecht University and the Royal
Netherlands Institute for Sea Research.

First reported by U.S. scientists in 2003, the MECO warming period
has been documented by data from a smattering of sites around the
world. Our paper is among the first to show that CO2 concentrations
and the temperature varied hand in hand in that time, says Peter
Bijl, a paleoclimatologist at the Netherlands Utretcht University
and one of the paper s lead authors.

The study may help put to rest some of the doubts expressed about
today s climate models because it describes an actual warming event
rather than one predicted by a model, according to Jeff Kiehl, head
of the Climate Change Research Section at the National Center for
Atmospheric Research in Boulder, CO.

[ . . . ]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS1...oomia_ow=t0:s0....

= = = = = = = = = = = =
Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 763 - 764
DOI: 10.1126/science.1197894
Increased Atmospheric CO2 During the Middle Eocene
Paul N. Pearson
Even without humans, there are many processes that can change the
concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2) in Earth's atmosphere and
affect global climate. On page 819 of this issue, Bijl et al. (1)
provide the first direct evidence that very high CO2 levels occurred
about 40 million years ago during the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum
(MECO), one of the hottest intervals in Earth's climate history. The
hunt is now on for a geological cause for this event and fingers are
pointing at the Himalayan mountain belt.

School of Earth and Ocean Sciences, Cardiff University, Cardiff CF10
3YE, UK.

E-mail:

The editors suggest the following Related Resources on Science sites:
In Science Magazine
REPORTS
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl, Alexander J. P. Houben, Stefan Schouten, Steven M.
Bohaty, Appy Sluijs, Gert-Jan Reichart, Jaap S. Sinninghe Damst , and
Henk Brinkhuis (5 November 2010)
Science 330 (6005), 819. [DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654]

http://sciencemagazine.com/search.ph....com&cachekey=...

Here's the abstract; you've got to pay for the rest.

Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 819 - 821
DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654
*Prev | Table of Contents | Next

Reports
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl,1,*, Alexander J. P. Houben,1,*, Stefan Schouten,2
Steven M. Bohaty,3 Appy Sluijs,1 Gert-Jan Reichart,4 Jaap S. Sinninghe
Damst ,2,4 Henk Brinkhuis1

The long-term warmth of the Eocene (~56 to 34 million years ago) is
commonly associated with elevated partial pressure of atmospheric
carbon dioxide (pCO2). However, a direct relationship between the two
has not been established for short-term climate perturbations. We
reconstructed changes in both pCO2 and temperature over an episode of
transient global warming called the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum
(MECO; ~40 million years ago). Organic molecular paleothermometry
indicates a warming of southwest Pacific sea surface temperatures
(SSTs) by 3 to 6 C. Reconstructions of pCO2 indicate a concomitant
increase by a factor of 2 to 3. The marked consistency between SST and
pCO2 trends during the MECO suggests that elevated pCO2 played a major
role in global warming during the MECO.

That's certainly got the deniers out in force to try everything they
can to deny it. mind you, it's not much.

It's really interesting research. The first time that a warming event
in the past has been attributed to CO2 without having to model its
effect. This is what patient, careful research does. It adds to the
knowledge base and it's yet another piece of research that makes
outright climate deniers just look stupid.

You are lying again. It never said that at all.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What did it say, then James? (This'll be interesting).

On Nov 9, 6:36*pm, "James" wrote:
"Roger Coppock" wrote in message







Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one predicted
by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike in
global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea temperatures
rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic sultry period, known
as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO), marked a 400,000-year-
long heat wave in the midst of a long era of global cooling.

Now research published Nov. 5 in the journal Science suggests the rise
in surface sea temperature occurred during a time when atmospheric
carbon dioxide (CO2) levels were particularly high, according to a
research team from Utrecht University and the Royal Netherlands
Institute for Sea Research.

Doesn't mean co2 caused it. Especially if co2 follows temps.


And your evidence for this claim is . . .





First reported by U.S. scientists in 2003, the MECO warming period has
been documented by data from a smattering of sites around the world.
Our paper is among the first to show that CO2 concentrations and the
temperature varied hand in hand in that time, says Peter Bijl, a
paleoclimatologist at the Netherlands Utretcht University and one of
the paper s lead authors.

The study may help put to rest some of the doubts expressed about
today s climate models because it describes an actual warming event
rather than one predicted by a model, according to Jeff Kiehl, head of
the Climate Change Research Section at the National Center for
Atmospheric Research in Boulder, CO.

[ . . . ]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS1...oomia_ow=t0:s0....

= = = = = = = = = = = =
Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 763 - 764
DOI: 10.1126/science.1197894
Increased Atmospheric CO2 During the Middle Eocene
Paul N. Pearson
Even without humans, there are many processes that can change the
concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2) in Earth's atmosphere and affect
global climate. On page 819 of this issue, Bijl et al. (1) provide the
first direct evidence that very high CO2 levels occurred about 40
million years ago during the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO),
one of the hottest intervals in Earth's climate history. The hunt is
now on for a geological cause for this event and fingers are pointing
at the Himalayan mountain belt.

School of Earth and Ocean Sciences, Cardiff University, Cardiff CF10
3YE, UK.

E-mail:

The editors suggest the following Related Resources on Science sites:
In Science Magazine
REPORTS
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl, Alexander J. P. Houben, Stefan Schouten, Steven M.
Bohaty, Appy Sluijs, Gert-Jan Reichart, Jaap S. Sinninghe Damst , and
Henk Brinkhuis (5 November 2010)
Science 330 (6005), 819. [DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654]

http://sciencemagazine.com/search.ph....com&cachekey=...

On Nov 10, 10:56*am, "James" wrote:
wrote in message







On Nov 9, 9:36 pm, "James" wrote:
"Roger Coppock" wrote in message



Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one
predicted by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike in
global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea temperatures
rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic sultry period, known
as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO), marked a 400,000-year-
long heat wave in the midst of a long era of global cooling.

Now research published Nov. 5 in the journal Science suggests the
rise in surface sea temperature occurred during a time when
atmospheric carbon dioxide (CO2) levels were particularly high,
according to a research team from Utrecht University and the Royal
Netherlands Institute for Sea Research.

Doesn't mean co2 caused it. Especially if co2 follows temps.

First reported by U.S. scientists in 2003, the MECO warming period
has been documented by data from a smattering of sites around the
world. Our paper is among the first to show that CO2 concentrations
and the temperature varied hand in hand in that time, says Peter
Bijl, a paleoclimatologist at the Netherlands Utretcht University
and one of the paper s lead authors.

The study may help put to rest some of the doubts expressed about
today s climate models because it describes an actual warming event
rather than one predicted by a model, according to Jeff Kiehl, head
of the Climate Change Research Section at the National Center for
Atmospheric Research in Boulder, CO.

[ . . . ]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS1...oomia_ow=t0:s0...

= = = = = = = = = = = =
Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 763 - 764
DOI: 10.1126/science.1197894
Increased Atmospheric CO2 During the Middle Eocene
Paul N. Pearson
Even without humans, there are many processes that can change the
concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2) in Earth's atmosphere and
affect global climate. On page 819 of this issue, Bijl et al. (1)
provide the first direct evidence that very high CO2 levels
occurred about 40 million years ago during the Middle Eocene
Climatic Optimum (MECO), one of the hottest intervals in Earth's
climate history. The hunt is now on for a geological cause for this
event and fingers are pointing at the Himalayan mountain belt.

School of Earth and Ocean Sciences, Cardiff University, Cardiff CF10
3YE, UK.

E-mail:

The editors suggest the following Related Resources on Science
sites: In Science Magazine
REPORTS
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl, Alexander J. P. Houben, Stefan Schouten, Steven M.
Bohaty, Appy Sluijs, Gert-Jan Reichart, Jaap S. Sinninghe Damst ,
and Henk Brinkhuis (5 November 2010)
Science 330 (6005), 819. [DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654]

http://sciencemagazine.com/search.ph....com&cachekey=...

"Played a major role" -- do you need your handlers to parse that for
you?

Didn't see that phrase but regardless there is no cause and effect here.

Obviously then, you did not read the article at all.

On 11/10/2010 2:18 PM, Roger Coppock wrote:
On Nov 9, 6:36 pm, wrote:
"Roger wrote in message







Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one predicted
by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike in
global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea temperatures
rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic sultry period, known
as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO), marked a 400,000-year-
long heat wave in the midst of a long era of global cooling.

Now research published Nov. 5 in the journal Science suggests the rise
in surface sea temperature occurred during a time when atmospheric
carbon dioxide (CO2) levels were particularly high, according to a
research team from Utrecht University and the Royal Netherlands
Institute for Sea Research.

Doesn't mean co2 caused it. Especially if co2 follows temps.


And your evidence for this claim is . . .

"Several recent papers have indeed *established that there is lag of CO2
behind temperature*. We don’t really know the magnitude of that lag as
well as Barton implies we do, because it is very challenging to put CO2
records from ice cores on the same timescale as temperature records from
those same ice cores, due to the time delay in trapping the atmosphere
as the snow is compressed into ice (the ice at any time will always be
younger older than the gas bubbles it encloses, and the age difference
is inherently uncertain). Still, the best published calculations do show
values similar to those quoted by Barton (presumably, taken from this
paper by Monnin et al. (2001), or this one by Caillon et al. (2003)).
But the calculations can only be done well when the temperature change
is large, notably at glacial terminations (the gradual change from cold
glacial climate to warm interglacial climate). Importantly, it takes
more than 5000 years for this change to occur, of which *the lag* is
only a small fraction (indeed, one recently submitted paper I’m aware of
suggests that the lag is even less than 200 years). So it is not as if
the temperature increase has already ended when CO2 starts to rise.
Rather, they go very much hand in hand, with the temperature continuing
to rise as the the CO2 goes up. In other words, CO2 acts as an
amplifier, just as Lorius, Hansen and colleagues suggested.

(emphasis added)

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php...-temp-and-co2/

"Dawlish" wrote in message

On Nov 10, 7:01 pm, "James" wrote:
"Dawlish" wrote in message







On Nov 10, 1:06 am, Roger Coppock wrote:
Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one
predicted by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike
in global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea
temperatures rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic
sultry period, known as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum (MECO),
marked a 400,000-year- long heat wave in the midst of a long era
of global cooling.

Now research published Nov. 5 in the journal Science suggests the
rise in surface sea temperature occurred during a time when
atmospheric carbon dioxide (CO2) levels were particularly high,
according to a research team from Utrecht University and the Royal
Netherlands Institute for Sea Research.

First reported by U.S. scientists in 2003, the MECO warming period
has been documented by data from a smattering of sites around the
world. Our paper is among the first to show that CO2 concentrations
and the temperature varied hand in hand in that time, says Peter
Bijl, a paleoclimatologist at the Netherlands Utretcht University
and one of the paper s lead authors.

The study may help put to rest some of the doubts expressed about
today s climate models because it describes an actual warming event
rather than one predicted by a model, according to Jeff Kiehl, head
of the Climate Change Research Section at the National Center for
Atmospheric Research in Boulder, CO.

[ . . . ]

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS1...oomia_ow=t0:s0...

= = = = = = = = = = = =
Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 763 - 764
DOI: 10.1126/science.1197894
Increased Atmospheric CO2 During the Middle Eocene
Paul N. Pearson
Even without humans, there are many processes that can change the
concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2) in Earth's atmosphere and
affect global climate. On page 819 of this issue, Bijl et al. (1)
provide the first direct evidence that very high CO2 levels
occurred about 40 million years ago during the Middle Eocene
Climatic Optimum (MECO), one of the hottest intervals in Earth's
climate history. The hunt is now on for a geological cause for
this event and fingers are pointing at the Himalayan mountain belt.

School of Earth and Ocean Sciences, Cardiff University, Cardiff
CF10 3YE, UK.

E-mail:

The editors suggest the following Related Resources on Science
sites: In Science Magazine
REPORTS
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl, Alexander J. P. Houben, Stefan Schouten, Steven M.
Bohaty, Appy Sluijs, Gert-Jan Reichart, Jaap S. Sinninghe Damst ,
and Henk Brinkhuis (5 November 2010)
Science 330 (6005), 819. [DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654]

http://sciencemagazine.com/search.ph....com&cachekey=...

Here's the abstract; you've got to pay for the rest.

Science 5 November 2010:
Vol. 330. no. 6005, pp. 819 - 821
DOI: 10.1126/science.1193654
Prev | Table of Contents | Next

Reports
Transient Middle Eocene Atmospheric CO2 and Temperature Variations
Peter K. Bijl,1,*, Alexander J. P. Houben,1,*, Stefan Schouten,2
Steven M. Bohaty,3 Appy Sluijs,1 Gert-Jan Reichart,4 Jaap S.
Sinninghe Damst ,2,4 Henk Brinkhuis1

The long-term warmth of the Eocene (~56 to 34 million years ago) is
commonly associated with elevated partial pressure of atmospheric
carbon dioxide (pCO2). However, a direct relationship between the
two has not been established for short-term climate perturbations.
We reconstructed changes in both pCO2 and temperature over an
episode of transient global warming called the Middle Eocene
Climatic Optimum (MECO; ~40 million years ago). Organic molecular
paleothermometry indicates a warming of southwest Pacific sea
surface temperatures (SSTs) by 3 to 6 C. Reconstructions of pCO2
indicate a concomitant increase by a factor of 2 to 3. The marked
consistency between SST and pCO2 trends during the MECO suggests
that elevated pCO2 played a major role in global warming during the
MECO.

That's certainly got the deniers out in force to try everything they
can to deny it. mind you, it's not much.

It's really interesting research. The first time that a warming
event in the past has been attributed to CO2 without having to
model its effect. This is what patient, careful research does. It
adds to the knowledge base and it's yet another piece of research
that makes outright climate deniers just look stupid.

You are lying again. It never said that at all.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What did it say, then James? (This'll be interesting).

You'll have to read what you wrote. Oh, wait. You just pull stuff out of
your ass and peck it in.

On Wed, 10 Nov 2010 10:08:02 -0800 (PST)
Dawlish wrote:

On Nov 10, 5:09Â*pm, Trawley Trash wrote:
On Tue, 9 Nov 2010 17:06:01 -0800 (PST)

Roger Coppock wrote:
Study Finds CO2 the Culprit in Ancient Global Warming

By Guest Writer at SolveClimate
Tue Nov 9, 2010 1:51pm EST
Scientists describe an actual warming event rather than one
predicted by a model

By Catherine M. Cooney

Some 40 million years ago, the world experienced an extreme spike
in global warming. The heat was so intense that deep sea
temperatures rose by about 4 degrees Celsius. This enigmatic
sultry period, known as the Middle Eocene Climatic Optimum
(MECO), marked a 400,000-year- long heat wave in the midst of a
long era of global cooling.

Â* truncated

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS1...oomia_ow=t0:s0...

Â* Is this a joke? Â*The is a news story, and it is written in a
Â* particularly deceptive way. Â*We read.

! Â* Kiehl said another intriguing find from the study is that 40
million ! Â* years ago water temperatures reached as high as 25
degrees Celsius ! Â* in areas where today the water is close to
freezing. “That is a ! Â* completely different world than what it is
today,â€� he said. “That ! Â* is very intriguing from an Earth system
perspective."

Â* Forty million years ago the continents and oceans were all in
Â* different places. Â*Australia was connected to Antarctica, and the
Â* poles were in different places too. Â*There is no such thing as the
Â* "same place" on earth 40 million years ago.

Â* I read through this three or four times, and *nowhere* does is
state how high the carbon dioxide level was at the time. Â*Without
that number the whole story is meaningless. Â*I *think* *maybe* it
was six times the present concentration which would make it
something over 2000 ppm. Â*

Â* Life survived. Â*The earth did not become a cinder.
Â* Civilization would survive such conditions, and at the present
Â* rate it would take 1000 years to get there. Â*One thing I am sure
Â* of is that we will not solving the problems of the next millennium
Â* with today's technology: Â*not unless technophobic creationists
Â* and their green allies succeed in bringing on a new dark age.

You could try reading the abstract, or better still the paper itself,
instead of expecting a newspapaer article to give you all the science
contained in the paper. Or you could think the newspaper article is
the full science.......which you probably do anyway, which is why you
are criticising it for not giving you it.

I was criticizing the newspaper article, not the science. If I dug
for it, I am sure the estimated eocene CO2 concentration is somewhere
in the scientific papers. The newsworthiness of the story depends on
the atmosphere of fear built up in the media. That is what I am
countering.

Did the newspaper article reference the scientific papers? No, it did
not.

The post was divided into two parts. It was not clear to me that the
second part is related to the first. The first part only talks about
the Reuters story. The article in Science requires payment, so I
am not going to read it. Maybe they should change the name of the
mag from *Science* to *Esotericism*.

sorry, about mistaking Eocene with Eemian (interglacial,
the one before this-here Holocene, if it still is on .-)
good quote, abovesville;
the difficulty is especially noted, re ice cores etc.,
on the http://21stcenturysciencetech.com site,
over quite a few articles. (sorry, if they seem
to be Denierists .-)

thus:
if you'd put it into an English wordproblemma,
which is all that mathematics really is
-- in terms of the quadrivium, of course,
or "maths" -- maybe I could tell,
where you are wrong about the patent-office inspector
-- light grounding in engineering, eh? --
amendation (with Poincare' etc. etc.) of galilean rel.

really simple, without Minkowski's pants on, or
Alfred's reification of Fig Newton's "theory"
of corpuscles, absolutely imploded by Young,
Fresnel, Liebniz etc. etc. I mean, I guess,
it *is* the unofficial, secular, Second Church
of England; eh?

thus: solve Fermat's problem set, or
get the **** away from the math (see the sig;
I'd suggest beginning with the "reconstruction
of euclid's porisms," in Geometrical Fragments
of *L'OEuvre* .-)

thus: seems like guys arguing, who believe in a)
Minkowski's pants, and b)
that "photons" are zero-dimensional branes, because
herr doktor-professor, patent-office inspector, said,
So, and the Nobel Cmte. also said, 'Tis so,
we must reify Fig Newtons "theory" of corpuscles
in the year cce 1905 -- praise-be! (just be thankful,
there is no God-am such prize in mathematics and/or
economics .-)... guys, who probably also fell
for Lord Berty's sillygistic "paradoxes," I wonder.

one should give *some* of the doubt
to herr doktor-professor, patent-office inspector,
by taking a look at a recent, totally hagiographical
book, _Einstein's Mistakes_, a blow-by-blow account
of his publications & correspondence, certain
to make the typical/adolescent "antisemite" or "self-
abnegating Jew" want to throw it into traffic.

myself, I got so woozy, just skinmming, that
I had to grab my book-holding hand & force it
to put it back on the shelf at the bookstore,
sort of like that funny movie
about Carl Sagan's mentor (his own version,
call PBS .-)

thus: like, HOPE was an acronym?... also, A.T.M.
(voting-machine) certainly is (so, take a guess).

--les ducs d'oil sont Beyondeesh Peak-petroleumeeshTM!
http://tarpley.net

--Lumiere, Un Histoire!
http://wlym.com

two parts, brought to you by the courtesy
of the owls in Harry Potter PS#1, Oxford.

thus:
I found an incredibly deep. mathematical treatise
on the power of wind.drag, but
it made no definitive formula, like "fourth-power
of delta-velocity; so, there. endquote

thus: sorry, for mistaking Eocene with Eemian (interglacial,
the one before this-here Holocene, if it still is on .-)
good quote, abovesville;
the difficulty is especially noted, re ice cores etc.,
on the http://21stcenturysciencetech.com site,
over quite a few articles. (sorry, if they seem
to be Denierists .-)

thus: if you'd put it into an English wordproblemma,
which is all that mathematics really is
-- in terms of the quadrivium, of course,
or "maths" -- maybe I could tell,
where you are wrong about the patent-office inspector
-- light grounding in engineering, eh? --
amendation (with Poincare' etc. etc.) of galilean rel.

really simple, without Minkowski's pants on, or
Alfred's reification of Fig Newton's "theory"
of corpuscles, absolutely imploded by Young,
Fresnel, Liebniz etc. etc. I mean, I guess,
it *is* the unofficial, secular, Second Church
of England; eh?

thus: solve Fermat's problem set, or
get the **** away from the math (see the sig;
I'd suggest beginning with the "reconstruction
of euclid's porisms," in Geometrical Fragments
of *L'OEuvre* .-)

thus: seems like guys arguing, who believe in a)
Minkowski's pants, and b)
that "photons" are zero-dimensional branes, because
herr doktor-professor, patent-office inspector, said,
So, and the Nobel Cmte. also said, 'Tis so,
we must reify Fig Newtons "theory" of corpuscles
in the year cce 1905 -- praise-be! (just be thankful,
there is no God-am such prize in mathematics and/or
economics .-)... guys, who probably also fell
for Lord Berty's sillygistic "paradoxes," I wonder.

one should give *some* of the doubt
to herr doktor-professor, patent-office inspector,
by taking a look at a recent, totally hagiographical
book, _Einstein's Mistakes_, a blow-by-blow account
of his publications & correspondence, certain
to make the typical/adolescent "antisemite" or "self-
abnegating Jew" want to throw it into traffic.

myself, I got so woozy, just skinmming, that
I had to grab my book-holding hand & force it
to put it back on the shelf at the bookstore,
sort of like that funny movie
about Carl Sagan's mentor (his own version,
call PBS .-)

thus: like, HOPE was an acronym?... also, A.T.M.
(voting-machine) certainly is (so, take a guess).

--les ducs d'oil sont Beyondeesh Peak-petroleumeeshTM!
http://tarpley.net

--Lumiere, Un Histoire!
http://wlym.com