"Philip Eden" philipATweatherHYPHENukDOTcom wrote:


"Martin Rowley" wrote in message
...
"JPG" wrote

I find that statement by Mr McElwee remarkably unhelpful to the cause
of climbing out of this slough of dumbing down and general ignorance
which is pervading this country. Semantics it certainly isn't! A
squall line and a tornado are completely distinct phenomena, as well
we all know. Supporting the general scientific ignorance by
indicating that just because the effects are the same, so must the
meteorology producing it, is unacceptable from a scientific
professional.

... the BBC Weather Centre are getting themselves in a real mess on this
one. Obviously someone higher up the chain has told them to say it is a
squall line, but from the footage I've seen on N24, some, if not all of
the events must have been linked to tornado development; the damage
reported, and the eye-witness reports of 'roaring winds' etc., would all
suggest that the cold front spawned a multiple outbreak of relatively
weak tornadoes (T2 generally) along it's length: more investigation would
reveal this.

What is disappointing is that whilst the N24 presenters were linking
together the viewers responses, and also interviewing Dr. Meaden, the
'strap line' at the bottom boldly stated that the BBC Weather Centre
stated it was a squall line! Egg on faces time I think: you don't rule
out *anything* until proper investigation on the ground and after a few
days reflection.

It seems to me that the sensible line to take is that this was a vigorous
cold front with squall-line characteristics, that some of the damage was
quite probably caused by tornadic phenomena, but that some was
just as likely caused by straight-line winds, and that it is impossible
to tell which was which until experts have carried out site-surveys and
interviewed eye-witnesses. Such very active cold fronts are not
untypical of autumn and early-winter and characteristically bring
swarms of short-lived tornadoes. (105 on 23 Nov 1981).

Anyway, it's the line I'm taking ...!

Philip

There have been eye-witness reports on News-24 describing rotating clouds
and, in Luton, a 4-metre-wide tornado tracking across gardens.

--
Graham P Davis
Bracknell, Berks., UK
Send e-mails to "newsman" as mails to "newsboy" are ignored.

On Sep 24, 12:58 pm, JPG wrote:
On 24 Sep, 11:17, Graham P Davis wrote:

Ian wrote:

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/rtrs/200709...ornadoes-fa6b4...

Ian,

Raunds, East Northants.

BBC are banging on about a series of "mini-tornados".http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7010172.stm
Just before 1100, Rob McElwee said "whether it's a line squall or tornado is
a matter of semantics"!!!!!

I find that statement by Mr McElwee remarkably unhelpful to the cause
of climbing out of this slough of dumbing down and general ignorance
which is pervading this country. Semantics it certainly isn't! A
squall line and a tornado are completely distinct phenomena, as well
we all know. Supporting the general scientific ignorance by
indicating that just because the effects are the same, so must the
meteorology producing it, is unacceptable from a scientific
professional.

I hope Rob, whom I think is one the better TV weatherpersons, reads
this and retracts.

Martin





At least Classic FM news is reporting tornados and eschewing "mini".

--
Graham P Davis
Bracknell, Berks., UK
Send e-mails to "newsman" as mails to "newsboy" are ignored.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I think Rob McElwee is a good meteorologist but quite unsuitable
as a presenter especially on the radio. His latest "semantic"
solecism was at 1257 today on R4 when he said we were going from
summer straight to early winter, bypassing autumn. Not a useful
remark. A few days ago he said the wind was going to go round to
northerly "and we all know what that means". Well, we do here, but
what about Joe public? He may as well have added "Nudge, nudge!" He
should stop trying to be the comedian, or the bloke down the pub.

Tudor Hughes, Warlingham, Surrey.

In article om, dated
Tue, 25 Sep 2007, Tudor Hughes wrote
On Sep 24, 12:58 pm, JPG wrote:
On 24 Sep, 11:17, Graham P Davis wrote:

Ian wrote:

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/rtrs/200709...ornadoes-fa6b4...

Ian,

Raunds, East Northants.

BBC are banging on about a series of
"mini-tornados".http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7010172.stm
Just before 1100, Rob McElwee said "whether it's a line squall or
tornado is
a matter of semantics"!!!!!

I find that statement by Mr McElwee remarkably unhelpful to the cause
of climbing out of this slough of dumbing down and general ignorance
which is pervading this country. Semantics it certainly isn't! A
squall line and a tornado are completely distinct phenomena, as well
we all know. Supporting the general scientific ignorance by
indicating that just because the effects are the same, so must the
meteorology producing it, is unacceptable from a scientific
professional.

I hope Rob, whom I think is one the better TV weatherpersons, reads
this and retracts.

Martin





At least Classic FM news is reporting tornados and eschewing "mini".

--
Graham P Davis
Bracknell, Berks., UK
Send e-mails to "newsman" as mails to "newsboy" are ignored.- Hide
quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I think Rob McElwee is a good meteorologist but quite unsuitable
as a presenter especially on the radio. His latest "semantic"
solecism was at 1257 today on R4 when he said we were going from
summer straight to early winter, bypassing autumn. Not a useful
remark. A few days ago he said the wind was going to go round to
northerly "and we all know what that means". Well, we do here, but
what about Joe public? He may as well have added "Nudge, nudge!" He
should stop trying to be the comedian, or the bloke down the pub.

Comedian is right - he always reminds me inescapably of Paul Whitehouse.
I expect him to say 'Scorchio' any day. Not this summer, of course.

Mind you, at least he doesn't go in for 'old', as in chilly old, silly
old Philip Avery. That really gets on my nerves.

--
Kate B

PS 'elvira' is spamtrapped - please reply to 'elviraspam' at cockaigne if you want
to reply personally

"Kate Brown" wrote in message
...
I think Rob McElwee is a good meteorologist but quite unsuitable
as a presenter especially on the radio. His latest "semantic"
solecism was at 1257 today on R4 when he said we were going from
summer straight to early winter, bypassing autumn. Not a useful
remark. A few days ago he said the wind was going to go round to
northerly "and we all know what that means". Well, we do here, but
what about Joe public? He may as well have added "Nudge, nudge!" He
should stop trying to be the comedian, or the bloke down the pub.

Comedian is right - he always reminds me inescapably of Paul Whitehouse. I
expect him to say 'Scorchio' any day. Not this summer, of course.

Mind you, at least he doesn't go in for 'old', as in chilly old, silly old
Philip Avery. That really gets on my nerves.

Forecasters should stop willing on winter and concentrate on Autumn. Perhaps
if they cared to show the bigger picture (in this case the origin of the
air) in the form of temperature profiles they could better explain why it
feels relatively cold at the moment. Instead they witter on like caged birds
as if they really have no interest or access to technical information
themselves.