this from a press feed dated yesterday (13th) ...... [ one of many
over the past few days chasing this particular system across the
northern States]

" Winter-like storms blamed
for at least two dozen deaths in the central United States moved
east Thursday to the mid-Atlantic region and New England.
In Connecticut, state troopers responded to more than 100
crashes in the hours after the storm started, The Hartford Courant
reported. One of the worst hit areas was Hartford, Conn., where two
interstates meet in the center of the city. In Manchester, outside
Hartford, two tractor-trailers jackknifed, partly blocking an icy
I-84.
"We're holding our head above water," said Trooper William
Tate, a state police spokesman. "It's just a matter of getting
through the storm."
The National Weather Service predicted as much as 10 inches
of snow in parts of New Jersey and 6 inches in neighboring states.
In the central United States, thousands of people remained
without power after ice storms, with Oklahoma hit the worst. Hotels
were filled by people without electricity or heat at home, and
restaurants reported heavy business from those seeking a hot meal."

As we've discussed before, goodness knows what would happen this side
of the pond.

Martin.


--
Martin Rowley
E:
W: booty.org.uk

As we've discussed before, goodness knows what would happen this side of
the pond.

Martin.


--
Martin Rowley
E:
W: booty.org.uk
---------------------------------

I doubt we'll ever know :-( . At least their headlines are justified.

Dave

On Fri, 14 Dec 2007, you wrote
this from a press feed dated yesterday (13th) ...... [ one of many
over the past few days chasing this particular system across the
northern States]

" Winter-like storms blamed
for at least two dozen deaths in the central United States moved
east Thursday to the mid-Atlantic region and New England.
In Connecticut, state troopers responded to more than 100
crashes in the hours after the storm started, The Hartford Courant
reported. One of the worst hit areas was Hartford, Conn., where two
interstates meet in the center of the city. In Manchester, outside
Hartford, two tractor-trailers jackknifed, partly blocking an icy
I-84.
"We're holding our head above water," said Trooper William
Tate, a state police spokesman. "It's just a matter of getting
through the storm."
The National Weather Service predicted as much as 10 inches
of snow in parts of New Jersey and 6 inches in neighboring states.
In the central United States, thousands of people remained
without power after ice storms, with Oklahoma hit the worst. Hotels
were filled by people without electricity or heat at home, and
restaurants reported heavy business from those seeking a hot meal."

As we've discussed before, goodness knows what would happen this side
of the pond.


Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that kind
of scale?

Mind you, it also freezes solid any chance of persuading the US to take
reduction of carbon emissions seriously.

(What do they mean, winter-'like'? It *is* winter, for heaven's sake!)

--
Kate B

London

"Kate Brown" wrote...

Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that
kind of scale?


It could, and certainly has happened in the past, though probably less
likely to this reported extent here than in the US/Canada. However,
there is one notable example: according to records (though NOT
contemporary reports, due to wartime restrictions), the
'longest-lasting' Rain - Ice event occurred 27th/28th January to 3rd
February 1940. There was severe dislocation to transport (railways
badly affected), with a large area from north Wales to the south and
west Midlands, the southwest of England and the 'Wessex' areas (i.e.
central-southern England). Lamb in 'The English Climate' has this ....
" Extensive thick ice, no traffic, birds had wings frozen to bodies,
and feet to the ground. Branches/telegraph wires collapsed by great
weight of ice. Electricity lines were coated with up to 4" (diameter)
of ice."

The problem for us is not so much the *specifics* though: a localised
fall of snow across the A30 a few years back in the Bodmin Moor area
caused much distress - we haven't seen a widespread persistent deep /
drifted snow situation for example across southern Britain for many
years.

Martin.



--
Martin Rowley
E:
W: booty.org.uk

In article ,
Kate Brown writes:
Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that kind
of scale?

I think the last time we had something of that severity over a widish
area was probably in January, 1940, when central Southern England was
badly affected. Obviously less severe cases happen more frequerntly.

Mind you, it also freezes solid any chance of persuading the US to take
reduction of carbon emissions seriously.

(What do they mean, winter-'like'? It *is* winter, for heaven's sake!)

Yes, I thought that too.
--
John Hall
"Honest criticism is hard to take,
particularly from a relative, a friend,
an acquaintance, or a stranger." Franklin P Jones

"Martin Rowley" wrote in message
...
"Kate Brown" wrote...

Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that kind
of scale?


It could, and certainly has happened in the past, though probably less
likely to this reported extent here than in the US/Canada. However, there
is one notable example: according to records (though NOT contemporary
reports, due to wartime restrictions), the 'longest-lasting' Rain - Ice
event occurred 27th/28th January to 3rd February 1940. There was severe
dislocation to transport (railways badly affected), with a large area from
north Wales to the south and west Midlands, the southwest of England and
the 'Wessex' areas (i.e. central-southern England). Lamb in 'The English
Climate' has this .... " Extensive thick ice, no traffic, birds had wings
frozen to bodies, and feet to the ground. Branches/telegraph wires
collapsed by great weight of ice. Electricity lines were coated with up to
4" (diameter) of ice."

My dad told me recently about drastic ice accumulations from freezing rain
in March 1969, which subsequently brought down Emley Moor transmitter mast.

He's got some remarkable pictures somewhere.

The problem for us is not so much the *specifics* though: a localised fall
of snow across the A30 a few years back in the Bodmin Moor area caused
much distress - we haven't seen a widespread persistent deep / drifted
snow situation for example across southern Britain for many years.

Martin.

"John Hall" wrote:
Kate Brown writes:

Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that kind
of scale?

I think the last time we had something of that severity over a widish
area was probably in January, 1940, when central Southern England was
badly affected. Obviously less severe cases happen more frequerntly.

Yes, 1940, as Martin described. It is widely ascribed in the literature
to a quite exceptional coincidence (and persistence) of circumstances,
and which seems to have no precedent - or even approach - either in
the instrumental era or anecdotally before that.

Mind you, it also freezes solid any chance of persuading the US to take
reduction of carbon emissions seriously.

(What do they mean, winter-'like'? It *is* winter, for heaven's sake!)

Yes, I thought that too.
--
I did too, and then I realised that Americans (or their media, at
least) have this slavish adherance to the astronomical seasons, so
winter doesn't begin until the solstice and anything that happens
before that can therefore only be "winter-like".

Philip

Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that kind of
scale?

Errr, rarely.

But I do remember the freezing rain that brought mainly places to a complete
standstill for a couple of days (30th/31st December 1995).

My car (and everybody elses) was encased in thick ice making it impossible
to get the key in the lock or even open the door. Driving was out of the
question anyway and walking anywhere was lethal. Everything was covered in a
layer of clear, smooth ice.

Smaller branches of trees were brought down (and a few large ones),
telephone wires were stretched under the wait of attached ice, so much so
that some were nearly reaching the ground.

We were supposed to go to a big New Year's Eve party but I think everyone
stayed in that year. Well, we did managed to walk to the local pub (all of
200 yards), but that was dangerous enough.

It must have been because most people were on holiday that nobody I mention
this to ever seems to remember it. Now, if it had happened during a normal
weekday in January then things would be whole different story.
________________
Nick G
Otter Valley, Devon
83 m amsl
http://www.ottervalley.co.uk

On 14 Dec, 10:15, "Martin Rowley"
wrote:
"Kate Brown" wrote...

Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that
kind of scale?

It could, and certainly has happened in the past, though probably less
likely to this reported extent here than in the US/Canada. However,
there is one notable example: according to records (though NOT
contemporary reports, due to wartime restrictions), the
'longest-lasting' Rain - Ice event occurred 27th/28th January to 3rd
February 1940. There was severe dislocation to transport (railways
badly affected), with a large area from north Wales to the south and
west Midlands, the southwest of England and the 'Wessex' areas (i.e.
central-southern England). Lamb in 'The English Climate' has this ....
" Extensive thick ice, no traffic, birds had wings frozen to bodies,
and feet to the ground. Branches/telegraph wires collapsed by great
weight of ice. Electricity lines were coated with up to 4" (diameter)
of ice."

The problem for us is not so much the *specifics* though: a localised
fall of snow across the A30 a few years back in the Bodmin Moor area
caused much distress - we haven't seen a widespread persistent deep /
drifted snow situation for example across southern Britain for many
years.


As evidenced by the removal some years ago of snow fences along the
A417 between Cirencester and Gloucester.

Martin.

--
Martin Rowley
E:
W: booty.org.uk

"Nick Gardner" wrote in message
...
Could it happen this side of the pond? I mean, ice storms on that kind
of scale?

Errr, rarely.

But I do remember the freezing rain that brought mainly places to a
complete standstill for a couple of days (30th/31st December 1995).


I remember the day of freezing rain on 20 Jan 1966; snow had been forecast
after a very cold few days and maxima below freezing on the 19th which was
also sunny. I remember a snow flurry soon after arriving at my office at
0900 on the 20th and I announced , foolishly, that it would snow for most of
the day. Within a few minutes the snow had been replaced by rain and the
temperature was , as far as I recall, around -3c. It rained throughout the
day. I cycled home for lunch, slipped on the sheet ice on the road and
sprawled on the tarmac. I had difficulty in standing because of the ice. The
lunchtime temperature was -2c. Icicles were hanging from gutters and trees.
By evening , the temperature had risen above freezing and the rain had
stopped. This day marked the end of the cold spell and there was very
little more until the wintry spell in mid-April.

I think it would be a busy day on the NG if we had a day similar to 20 Jan
1966.

Peter Clarke
Ewell, Epsom