hi,

Been looking at the FAQ, particularly the glossary. I've not been able
to find the following definitions:

very mild
mild
severe

What I'm looking for really is how various areas of the UK are
quantified in terms are climate. We know that for instance Cornwall
has a very mild maritime climate. But is East Anglia also maritime?
I'd say it was more continental than Cornwall. But what is the
definition? What is "very mild" ?

wrote in message
...
hi,

Been looking at the FAQ, particularly the glossary. I've not been
able
to find the following definitions:

very mild
mild
severe

What I'm looking for really is how various areas of the UK are
quantified in terms are climate. We know that for instance Cornwall
has a very mild maritime climate. But is East Anglia also maritime?
I'd say it was more continental than Cornwall. But what is the
definition? What is "very mild" ?

.... been trying to find the definitions on the Met Office web site,
but can't off hand. Will have another go tomorrow if no-one else
pitches in.

In the meantime, this might prove useful.

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/educatio...ukclimate.html

I think, though, that you are asking questions that might be better
addressed by getting hold of a good text book on British/Irish
weather; there are many, but one I would go for straight off is
"Regional Climates of the British Isles", ed. Wheeler & Mayes,
published by Routledge. If it's not in print, Amazon (or similar) are
bound to have a copy available. Well worth the outlay.

Martin.


--
Martin Rowley
West Moors, East Dorset (UK): 17m (56ft) amsl
Lat: 50.82N Long: 01.88W
NGR: SU 082 023

wrote in message
Been looking at the FAQ, particularly the glossary. I've not been
able
to find the following definitions:
very mild
mild
severe
What I'm looking for really is how various areas of the UK are
quantified in terms are climate. We know that for instance Cornwall
has a very mild maritime climate. But is East Anglia also maritime?
I'd say it was more continental than Cornwall. But what is the
definition? What is "very mild" ?

"Martin Rowley" wrote...

... been trying to find the definitions on the Met Office web site,
but can't off hand. Will have another go tomorrow if no-one else
pitches in.

In the meantime, this might prove useful.

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/educatio...ukclimate.html

I think, though, that you are asking questions that might be better
addressed by getting hold of a good text book on British/Irish
weather; there are many, but one I would go for straight off is
"Regional Climates of the British Isles", ed. Wheeler & Mayes,
published by Routledge. If it's not in print, Amazon (or similar)
are bound to have a copy available. Well worth the outlay.

.... I'm not sure, re-reading your original, whether you are asking
about the criteria attached to the terms 'mild', 'cold', 'warm' etc.,
or climate classification.

The terminology you quote, although obviously based on climatology
(long-term average temperatures), are/were intended for use in weather
*forecasts*, to give a short-hand idea of what a specific range of
maximum temperatures might 'feel like' to the general public. They are
controversial - a search of this newsgroup will bring up many
references to such, which is maybe why I can't now find them on the
Met Office web site.

However, this was posted several years ago and gives you a good idea
of what each term means:-

http://groups.google.co.uk/group/uk....1e8d7880?hl=en
[possibly wrapped]

However, I fancy you are actually asking about climate classification,
which is a big subject. In terms of temperature, one of the simplest
methods to distinguish between an 'oceanic' (or maritime) location and
a 'continental' spot is to look at the annual *range* of the mean
temperature, i.e., the difference between the average annual maximum
temperature and the average annual minimum temperature (as an example,
there are others). Most good school atlases have typical graphs of
maximum/minimum temperatures through the year for locations around the
globe: maritime spots generally have a 'flattened' profile, when
compared with stations in the middle of a large continent; the
difference across a smaller country such as ours won't be as dramatic,
but nevertheless, it can be detected.

As I alluded to in the previous post, the whole subject is
complicated, and other schemes have been devised which integrate
things like precipitation (averages, extremes, temporal variation [
i.e. the distribution of rainfall across the year ] etc.), and for
specific purposes (such as agriculture/arboriculture) then length of
growing season, which brings in such as soil temperature as well as
precipitation, are used.

A search using the phrase 'climate classification' will pull up many
references.

Martin.

--
Martin Rowley
West Moors, East Dorset (UK): 17m (56ft) amsl
Lat: 50.82N Long: 01.88W
NGR: SU 082 023

Many thanks Martin for taking the time to answer. You've given me some
good pointers there. I think I should have given more info in my
original question though, in order to establish context.

It's really from an agricultural standpoint that I'm asking (doing
this on behalf of a collection of allotment holders around the
country). What I mean is something like, let's say someone near Lands
End - this climate is going to be:

1. Maritime
2. Very Mild definition of
3. avg last frost
4. prevailing airmass returning subtropical maritime
5. damp definition of

and for Inverness something like
1. maritime
2. cool definition of
3. average last frost
4. prevailing airmass returning polar maritime
5. wet definition of

and for East Anglia
1. modified maritime definition of
2. warm definition of
3. average last frost date
4. prevailing air mass ?
5. semi-arid definition of

It's the categories and definitions of stuff that I'm after

I thought it would be easier to find, given that there's a lot of work
in the area of climate change, and if we're going to measure that,
then we need to know the type of climate for a number of given
locations or areas to measure from!

In terms of climate classifications, I can readily obtain world
classifications, but am having difficulty for ones within the British
Isles, probably because generally we have weather rather than climate,
and that if we determine we have 'climate' there are many 'climates'
within the British Isles, I guess.

Anyhow, thanks for your help so far

wrote in message
...
snip
It's really from an agricultural standpoint that I'm asking (doing
this on behalf of a collection of allotment holders around the
country). snip


It's the categories and definitions of stuff that I'm after

I thought it would be easier to find, given that there's a lot of
work
in the area of climate change, and if we're going to measure that,
then we need to know the type of climate for a number of given
locations or areas to measure from!

.... OK; I'm not going to be able to answer your specific points,
especially on the various definitions, because there are a number of
schemes that have been developed over the recent decades (and by that
I mean at least 60-odd years), and each one has merits and drawbacks.

I'm looking at a book entitled: "The Climate of the British Isles" (a
famous publication in the 'weather' world), Ed. Chandler and Gregory.
A wealth of facts and figures - it looks quite 'dry' (sorry!) if you
flick through it quickly, but there is a wealth of information
contained therein, though unfortunately, as the book was first
published in 1976, the data will obviously not necessarily apply to
current conditions. However, the broad ideas are sound.

In the final chapter ('Regional Climates') several schemes are
discussed for climate classification, and the one that comes closest
to that which you are interested in follows from work by one of the
co-editors: S. Gregory (references contained within the book).

At page 338, he publishes a map of the British Isles, which shows
regional climates " based on the length of the growing season, annual
rainfall conditions and the seasonal incidence of rainfall ".

To use your three examples:-
Lands End

This is in his class "AMw", which translates as follows:
A = length growing season** .. of 9 or more months.
M = (precise definition in the book), but essentially .. high rainfall
does not occur frequently (high, by implication from the table, is
=1250 mm a year), yet low rainfall (again, this would seem to be
=750 mm) is infrequent or not experienced.
w = maximum rainfall in the winter half of the year.

and for Inverness something like
This is in class "BD2"
B = growing season of 7 or 8 months.
D = at least 30% probability of annual rainfall = 750 mm. [ i.e.,
these are relatively 'dry'/D areas ]
2 = maximum rainfall in second-half of the year.

and for East Anglia
This is in class "BDs" [ essentially a slight variant of Inverness ]
B = growing season of 7 or 8 months.
D = at least 30% probability of annual rainfall = 750 mm. [ i.e.,
these are relatively 'dry'/D areas ]
s = a 'weakly developed tendency for a summer rainfall maximum'.

**BTW, the 'length of growing season' is based on accumulated
temperatures, with the critical value being 6°C. The book goes into
more detail on this aspect.

I can't comment further sadly - it's not really my area of expertise,
but you get the idea of how this author has gone about things, and
also how others might approach the problem.

Incidentally, though you can purchase second-hand copies of these
books I've mentioned, in this particular case, because it's a seminal
work, I know that many public libraries will either have a copy on the
shelf, or be able to reserve a copy.

Martin.


--
Martin Rowley
West Moors, East Dorset (UK): 17m (56ft) amsl
Lat: 50.82N Long: 01.88W
NGR: SU 082 023

wrote:

In terms of climate classifications, I can readily obtain world
classifications, but am having difficulty for ones within the British
Isles, probably because generally we have weather rather than climate,
and that if we determine we have 'climate' there are many 'climates'
within the British Isles, I guess.

Anyhow, thanks for your help so far

Yes, the various global classifications are for making the
broadest of comparisons and associations with flora, land-use,
etc (insofar as they are for anything).

For the sort of very specific and very local use you describe,
it seems to me that the sort of data your really ought to be
seeking are single-station averages, extremes, and key dates.

Also, having recently established a small weather station on an
allotment site (in Luton) and seen the interest the figures
generate among many of the allotment holders, I would
encourage you to advise your groups to do likewise, and
they can then learn quite quickly exactly the sort of
climatological characteristics their site has (perhaps comparing
them with averages from their nearest official weather station).

They will need to be properly sited, though!