On Tue, 2 Feb 2010 00:22:21 -0000, Philip Eden wrote in


Mike, I've only checked the figures for Aldergrove.
NI did not share in the long sequence of extremely low
night minima in Jan 1982, so that Dec/Jan was marginally
less cold. However, Dec/Jan 78-9 was colder at
Aldergrove. I've not checked 95-96 or 96-97.

2009-10 2.8°C
1981-82 3.0°C
1978-79 2.4°C

It's just possible, I suppose, that the regional NI
figure was the same as or slightly lower this year
than in 78-79, but a similar figure should suggest
that some parts of Ulster were higher and some
were lower, which would not excuse the dogmatic
"lowest for 47 years" ... at least for anyone with
half a brain :-)

Thanks so much for that. I hade a look through the data from my station,
1968 to 2002, and spotted something I always seem to forget. The same
period in 1976/77 had a mean here of only 2.7C. I then contacted Mark
Bailey at Armagh Observatory (obs started around 210 years ago) and he
kindly gave me the figures for there.

1962 Dec 4.5
1963 Jan 0.0

1976 Dec 1.8
1977 Jan 2.3

1978 Dec 4.3
1979 Jan 0.8

2009 Dec 3.0
2010 Jan 2.0

So not only was 76/77 a good deal colder than recently, it was in fact
colder than in the same two months in 62/63! That was a real surprise. I
wonder what Aldergrove was in 76/77?

--
Mike Tullett - Coleraine 55.13°N 6.69°W posted 2/2/2010 1:01:17 PM GMT

"Mike Tullett" wrote ...

snip earlier part of thread
Thanks so much for that. I hade a look through the data from my
station,
1968 to 2002, and spotted something I always seem to forget. The
same
period in 1976/77 had a mean here of only 2.7C. I then contacted
Mark
Bailey at Armagh Observatory (obs started around 210 years ago) and
he
kindly gave me the figures for there.

1962 Dec 4.5
1963 Jan 0.0

1976 Dec 1.8
1977 Jan 2.3

1978 Dec 4.3
1979 Jan 0.8

2009 Dec 3.0
2010 Jan 2.0

So not only was 76/77 a good deal colder than recently, it was in
fact
colder than in the same two months in 62/63! That was a real
surprise. I
wonder what Aldergrove was in 76/77?

.... From the Met. Office DWR/Monthly Summary:-

Aldergrove
1976 Dec Mean maximum 4.1, Mean minimum 0.3
1977 Jan Mean maximum 5.0, Mean minimum 0.0

I make that

1976 Dec 2.2
1977 Jan 2.5

BTW, you can get Armagh observations (monthly summary) he-
http://www.metoffice.com/climate/uk/...armaghdata.txt

and also Ballypatrick Forest
http://www.metoffice.com/climate/uk/...atrickdata.txt

Martin.


--
Martin Rowley
West Moors, East Dorset (UK): 17m (56ft) amsl
Lat: 50.82N Long: 01.88W
NGR: SU 082 023

"Martin Rowley" wrote:
"Mike Tullett" wrote ...

snip earlier part of thread
Thanks so much for that. I hade a look through the data from my station,
1968 to 2002, and spotted something I always seem to forget. The same
period in 1976/77 had a mean here of only 2.7C. I then contacted Mark
Bailey at Armagh Observatory (obs started around 210 years ago) and he
kindly gave me the figures for there.

1962 Dec 4.5
1963 Jan 0.0

1976 Dec 1.8
1977 Jan 2.3

1978 Dec 4.3
1979 Jan 0.8

2009 Dec 3.0
2010 Jan 2.0

So not only was 76/77 a good deal colder than recently, it was in fact
colder than in the same two months in 62/63! That was a real surprise.
I
wonder what Aldergrove was in 76/77?

... From the Met. Office DWR/Monthly Summary:-

Aldergrove
1976 Dec Mean maximum 4.1, Mean minimum 0.3
1977 Jan Mean maximum 5.0, Mean minimum 0.0

I make that

1976 Dec 2.2
1977 Jan 2.5

Mike ... I was working in Aberdeen during the 76-77 winter
and remember December especially as very snowy (checking
the MWR reveals 21 days with snow lying at Dyce in Dec
and 11 in Jan (probably mostly in the first half). Braemar had
28 and 26 respectively.

I agree with Martin's figures for Aldergrove, but it is worth
pointing out this his source and my source (MWR) all
pre-1984 data refers to 12h day max and night min rather
than 24h max and 24h min. My data for this winter is also
12h maxes and mins.

I've also checked the 1976-77 figures for Dyce (0.6 degC
lower than this winter), Eskdalemuir (same as this winter),
Lerwick (0.8degC lower than this winter), and
Stornoway (also 0.8 degC lower than this winter).

Curiouser and curiouser.

Philip

On Tue, 2 Feb 2010 13:52:49 -0000, Philip Eden wrote in


... From the Met. Office DWR/Monthly Summary:-

Aldergrove
1976 Dec Mean maximum 4.1, Mean minimum 0.3
1977 Jan Mean maximum 5.0, Mean minimum 0.0

I make that

1976 Dec 2.2
1977 Jan 2.5

Mike ... I was working in Aberdeen during the 76-77 winter
and remember December especially as very snowy (checking
the MWR reveals 21 days with snow lying at Dyce in Dec
and 11 in Jan (probably mostly in the first half). Braemar had
28 and 26 respectively.

I agree with Martin's figures for Aldergrove, but it is worth
pointing out this his source and my source (MWR) all
pre-1984 data refers to 12h day max and night min rather
than 24h max and 24h min. My data for this winter is also
12h maxes and mins.

I've also checked the 1976-77 figures for Dyce (0.6 degC
lower than this winter), Eskdalemuir (same as this winter),
Lerwick (0.8degC lower than this winter), and
Stornoway (also 0.8 degC lower than this winter).

Curiouser and curiouser.

I wonder how many besides me had forgotten 76/77. Anyway, thanks to both
Philip and Martin for the extra details.

--
Mike Tullett - Coleraine 55.13°N 6.69°W posted 2/2/2010 2:52:49 PM GMT

"Mike Tullett" wrote in message
I wonder how many besides me had forgotten 76/77. Anyway, thanks to both
Philip and Martin for the extra details.

--
Mike Tullett - Coleraine 55.13°N 6.69°W posted 2/2/2010 2:52:49 PM GMT

The five coldest December / January's I can find in this area (Lanarkshire)
are;

1981/82 -0.6ºC
2009/10 -0.1ºC
1978/79 +0.2ºC
1962/63 +0.3ºC
1976/77 +0.6ºC

As I said already, I'm fairly certain 1939/40 would appear high up this
list.
There seems no doubt this has not been the coldest Dec/Jan, though it may
have been the second coldest for some of us, particularly in the central
lowlands area.
I'll echo your thanks to Philip and Martin.

Alex.

Mike Tullett wrote:

On Tue, 2 Feb 2010 00:22:21 -0000, Philip Eden wrote in


Mike, I've only checked the figures for Aldergrove.
NI did not share in the long sequence of extremely low
night minima in Jan 1982, so that Dec/Jan was marginally
less cold. However, Dec/Jan 78-9 was colder at
Aldergrove. I've not checked 95-96 or 96-97.

2009-10 2.8°C
1981-82 3.0°C
1978-79 2.4°C

It's just possible, I suppose, that the regional NI
figure was the same as or slightly lower this year
than in 78-79, but a similar figure should suggest
that some parts of Ulster were higher and some
were lower, which would not excuse the dogmatic
"lowest for 47 years" ... at least for anyone with
half a brain :-)

Thanks so much for that. I hade a look through the data from my station,
1968 to 2002, and spotted something I always seem to forget. The same
period in 1976/77 had a mean here of only 2.7C. I then contacted Mark
Bailey at Armagh Observatory (obs started around 210 years ago) and he
kindly gave me the figures for there.

1962 Dec 4.5
1963 Jan 0.0

1976 Dec 1.8
1977 Jan 2.3

1978 Dec 4.3
1979 Jan 0.8

2009 Dec 3.0
2010 Jan 2.0

So not only was 76/77 a good deal colder than recently, it was in fact
colder than in the same two months in 62/63! That was a real surprise. I
wonder what Aldergrove was in 76/77?

Mike,

I haven't looked up any figures but my recollection is that 1962/63 wasn't
anything like as cold in NI as it was in England & Wales. NI was much like SW
Scotland that winter. I was commuting 30 miles each way between Largs and
Prestwick Airport by motorbike that winter and it wasn't too bad. NI did have a
notable blizzard, in Feb I think. The same blizzard affected the extreme SW of
Scotland but didn't extend as far north as Prestwick.


--
Norman Lynagh
Tideswell, Derbyshire
303m a.s.l.

Alex Stephens Jr wrote:

"Mike Tullett" wrote in message
I wonder how many besides me had forgotten 76/77. Anyway, thanks to both
Philip and Martin for the extra details.

-- Mike Tullett - Coleraine 55.130N 6.690W posted 2/2/2010 2:52:49 PM GMT

The five coldest December / January's I can find in this area (Lanarkshire)
are;

1981/82 -0.6:C
2009/10 -0.1:C
1978/79 +0.2:C
1962/63 +0.3:C
1976/77 +0.6:C

As I said already, I'm fairly certain 1939/40 would appear high up this list.
There seems no doubt this has not been the coldest Dec/Jan, though it may
have been the second coldest for some of us, particularly in the central
lowlands area. I'll echo your thanks to Philip and Martin.

Alex.

Although I wasn't around during the 1939/40 winter the local folklore in Largs,
Ayrshire where I was brought up was that 1940 was the big daddy of winters
there in the 20th century. I have seen photos of the snow that winter and in
terms of total depth and drifting it was certainly much greater than anything
in 1947 or 1963

--
Norman Lynagh
Tideswell, Derbyshire
303m a.s.l.