oriel36 scrive:


Every time I see the explanation which has 366 rotations in 365 days it
makes me shake my head,I wonder what happens when they encounter the
leap year from Mar 1st 2011 until Feb 29th 2012 which have 366 days in
it ! -

OK, enough is sufficient.

1 day equals one rotation of the earth on its axis.
1 year equals one rotation of the earth around the sun.

Human devised timing systems (clocks and calendars) are a rough
approximation of these things, They are not the same and they are not
equal.

Dividing one rotation of the sun by one rotation on the earth's axis does
not result in a whole number. Consequently, in an effort to keep the
human calendar roughly aligned with the seasons we add a leap day every
four calendar years.

That is all there is to it. It does not merit a lengthy treatise every
few weeks with futile attempts to compare a real day with the human
devised clock.
The earth rotates once each day, 365 times in 365 days, and 366 times in
366 days when we add a leap day to the calendar year (not to be confused
with a real year).

--
Gianna
Peterhead, Scotland

buchan-meteo.org.uk

On Jan 23, 2:07*pm, Buchan Meteo wrote:

That is all there is to it. It does not merit a lengthy treatise every
few weeks with futile attempts to compare a real day with the human
devised clock.
The earth rotates once each day, 365 times in 365 days, and 366 times in
366 days when we add a leap day to the calendar year (not to be confused
with a real year).

--
Gianna
Peterhead, Scotland

buchan-meteo.org.uk

You are sweet and you came to the right conclusion but this is where
your troubles only begin,at least in the U.K..It happens that Newton's
entire gravitational agenda is built on the equatorial coordinate
system which has at its core belief that the Earth turns 1465 times in
1461 days or the Ra/Dec system as it is known so you are really
jumping from the frying pan into the fire.But good for you anyway,if
you show up in a physics forum in demonstrating that the temperatures
go up and down once a day as this corresponds to a rotation of the
Earth through 360 degrees in step with the calendar cycle,and you will
be right,don't expect a pleasant welcome .

On Jan 23, 3:28*pm, oriel36 wrote:
On Jan 23, 2:07*pm, Buchan Meteo wrote:

That is all there is to it. It does not merit a lengthy treatise every
few weeks with futile attempts to compare a real day with the human
devised clock.
The earth rotates once each day, 365 times in 365 days, and 366 times in
366 days when we add a leap day to the calendar year (not to be confused
with a real year).

--
Gianna
Peterhead, Scotland

buchan-meteo.org.uk

You are sweet and you came to the right conclusion but this is where
your troubles only begin,at least in the U.K..It happens that Newton's
entire gravitational agenda is built on the equatorial coordinate
system which has at its core belief that the Earth turns 1465 times in
1461 days or the Ra/Dec system as it is known so you are really
jumping from the frying pan into the fire.But good for you anyway,if
you show up in a physics forum in demonstrating that the temperatures
go up and down once a day as this corresponds to a rotation of the
Earth through 360 degrees in step with the calendar cycle,and you will
be right,don't expect a pleasant welcome .

..........and you are most definitely deluded. I'm sure Gianna loved
being patronised by a nutcase.

Go away and have a long thing about a pebble, or something. *))

"oriel36" wrote in message
...

On Jan 20, 2:52 pm, Buchan Meteo wrote:
Martin Rowley scrive:

Is there a word (or short phrase) that explicitly covers the situation
we seem to have had many times this winter in this neck of the woods of
'upside-down' 24hr temperature profiles.

You might call it an inverse oriel ;-)

--
Gianna
Peterhead, Scotland

buchan-meteo.org.uk

Every time I see the explanation which has 366 rotations in 365 days
it makes me shake my head,I wonder what happens when they encounter
the leap year from Mar 1st 2011 until Feb 29th 2012 which have 366
days in it ! -

http://adsabs.harvard.edu/full/1904PA.....12..649B

So we have a Harvard/NASA explanation while the center of discussion
here is daily temperature fluctuations which would occur within a 24
period where local influences dominate the normal response of
temperature rises and falls due to the rotation of the Earth 1461
times across 4 years.

No offence,you would have to be a bunch of dummies to go along with
366 rotations in 365 days and I am not talking about the ability to
remain silent,if anger or intense irritation is not present then there
must be tumbleweeds going through your minds.

Anyone want to predict that temperatures will fall and rise within the
next 24 hours and the cause behind it ?,I wouldn't count on the NASA/
Harvard explanation which is merely an extension of the one that was
conceived in the late 17th century U.K..



Perhaps I've missed something here. The Earth does rotate on its axis 366
times in 365 days. Because of the fortuitous fact that the Earth rotates on
its axis in the same sense that it revolves round the Sun (i.e.
anti-clockwise when viewed from above the North Pole), it has to turn a tiny
bit more than 360 degrees to bring the Sun on to the meridian each day.
Rotating through this extra very small angle takes approximately 4 minutes.
365 times 4 minutes = approximately 1 day (approximately because the 4
minutes is approximate), hence the small daily extra rotation amounts to a
whole revolution at the end of a year. If you want to talk about 366 days,
then the Earth will have rotated 367 times (+ the tiny amount!). Or is this
what everyone has been saying? As I said, I may have missed something.
Actually it's not quite correct to say that the Earth rotates on its axis
every 24 hours - it's 23 hours and 56 minutes, and the 4 minutes makes it up
to 24 hours.

Ian Bingham,
Inchmarlo, Aberdeenshire.

On Jan 23, 3:48*pm, "Ian Bingham"
wrote:

Perhaps I've missed something here. *The Earth does rotate on its axis 366
times in 365 days.

The Earth turned 365 times from Mar 1st 2010 until Feb 28th 2011 and
will turn 366 times from Mar 1st 2011 until Feb 29th 2012 hence the
Earth turns once a day and daily temperatures (weather) responds to
that rotation.As temperatures fluctuate massively within each 24 hour
cycle,many magnitudes greater than the contentious long term
trends,readers here may gauge how relevant this is if the primary
input of daily rotation doesn't match the daily temperature
fluctuations or if the link is disputed by an 1465/1461 imbalance.

The primary unit of time is a proportion just as the Pi proportion
represents the correspondence between diameter and circumference
whereas in planetary terms the number of rotations is proportional to
the number of circuits of the Sun.The next reference is natural noon
where each noon to noon cycle varies in length yet there are still
1461 natural noon cycles which convert to 1461 AM/PM's enclosed in 4
years/4 orbital circuits.

If there are reasonable people here,they simply look again at what the
Egyptians are saying.They have an antecedent system of a steady
progressions of 365 days but find that they fall back through the
seasons without adding an extra day and it wouldn't change for us,If
we didn't add an extra day on Feb 29th and kept going with a constant
stream of days ending Feb 28th,within our lifetimes we would find
ourselves falling away from the solstice and equinox points of the
orbital circuit so that in 40 years we would begin to discover a
slight difference in the weather from what would be expected and after
80 years,which would amount to a 20 day separation,the absence of a
leap day correction would really be noticeable.


" on account of the precession of the rising of the Divine Sothis by
one day in the course of 4 years.. therefore it shall be, that the
year of 360 days and the 5 days added to their end, so one day as
feast of Benevolent Gods [the pharaoh and family] be from this day
after every 4 years added to the 5 epagomenae before the New Year,
whereby all men shall learn, that what was a little defective in the
order as regards the seasons and the year, as also the opinions which
are contained in the rules of the learned on the heavenly orbits, are
now corrected and improved.." Canopus Decree everything radiates out
from this including the conversion

If you establish the fundamental unit of time as the Egyptians did as
a 1461;4 proportion, everything radiates out from this including the
conversion of the variations in the 1461 natural noon cycles to the 24
hour clock noon and from there to where the steady/equable 24 hour day
substitutes for steady/equable rotation without the need of an
external reference.

It is not easy to make the conversion from days/years into rotations/
orbits yet it can be done but it ain't going to be done with a
1465/1461 imbalance.

*Because of the fortuitous fact that the Earth rotates on
its axis in the same sense that it revolves round the Sun (i.e.
anti-clockwise when viewed from above the North Pole), it has to turn a tiny
bit more than 360 degrees to bring the Sun on to the meridian each day.



Rotating through this extra very small angle takes approximately 4 minutes.
365 times 4 minutes = approximately 1 day (approximately because the 4
minutes is approximate), hence the small daily extra rotation amounts to a
whole revolution at the end of a year. *If you want to talk about 366 days,
then the Earth will have rotated 367 times (+ the tiny amount!). *Or is this
what everyone has been saying? *As I said, I may have missed something.
Actually it's not quite correct to say that the Earth rotates on its axis
every 24 hours - it's 23 hours and 56 minutes, and the 4 minutes makes it up
to 24 hours.


Try John Harrison who built his watches on the principles that 1 hour
time difference equates to 15 degrees longitude and a turning
Earth.This is your heritage and if Harrison is not good enough to
give you an idea that something went drastically wrong then nothing
will and I mean that -

"The application of a Timekeeper to this discovery is founded upon the
following principles: the earth's surface is divided into 360 equal
parts (by imaginary lines drawn from North to South) which are called
Degrees of Longitude; and its daily revolution Eastward round its own
axis is performed in 24 hours; consequently in that period, each of
those imaginary lines or degrees, becomes successively opposite to the
Sun (which makes the noon or precise middle of the day at each of
those degrees and it must follow, that from the time any one of
those lines passes the Sun, till the next passes, must be just four
minutes, for 24 hours being divided by 360 will give that quantity; so
that for every degree of Longitude we sail Westward, it will be noon
with us four minutes the later, and for every degree Eastward four
minutes the sooner, and so on in proportion for any greater or less
quantity. Now, the exact time of the day at the place where we are,
can be ascertained by well known and easy observations of the Sun if
visible for a few minutes at any time from his being ten degrees high
until within an hour of noon, or from an hour after noon until he is
only 10 degrees high in the afternoon; if therefore, at any time when
such observation is made, a Timekeeper tells us at the same moment
what o'clock it is at the place we sailed from, our Longitude is
clearly discovered." John Harrison

I repeat,the conversion is complicated yet there is nothing difficult
in the core principles which match the rotation of the Earth with
daily temperature fluctuations,if nobody can match one with the other
then there is really nothing left to say.





Ian Bingham,
Inchmarlo, Aberdeenshire.

"Buchan Meteo" wrote in message
...
The earth rotates once each day, 365 times in 365 days, and 366 times in
366 days when we add a leap day to the calendar year (not to be confused
with a real year).

No, this is what oriel36 asserts himself and is incorrect.
(He actually has no problem understanding the leap year cycle, quoting ad
nauseam from the ancent Egyptians and other historic sources on the topic.)

The earth rotates once each day *relative to the sun* (that's how we measure
days), but because of its orbit around the sun, the number of rotations in a
year, relative to the stars (which we may regard as a fixed direction in
space) is *one more* than the number of days. See Ian Binghams' post in this
thread.

So in a four-year cycle of 1461 days, the earth rotates 1465 times about its
own axis. It is this that oriel36 refuses to accept, believing it to be an
abomination, and the sun to be the only true reference point - he even goes
as far as to dismiss Newton's 'gravitational agenda'.

I initially tried to respond to his posts in an attempt to understand what
he was trying to say behind the strange language used.
I now see he's completely deluded and it's pointless trying to convince him
of anything as he just regurgitates the same stuff again and again.
It's best just to ignore him from now on.

Actually it's not quite correct to
say that the Earth rotates on its axis every 24 hours - it's 23 hours
and 56 minutes, and the 4 minutes makes it up to 24 hours.

Ian Bingham,
Inchmarlo, Aberdeenshire.

The obvious solution is to shorten the definition of a second from it's
9,162,613,770 oscillations per second of caesium 133. So that the
measurement of the earth's rotation in a day exactly equals 24 hours.

Of course, by changing the definition of a second, it'll have major
implications for our high tech electronic world, from mobile phones to
the internet not working.

Joe Egginton
Wolverhampton
175m ASL

On Jan 23, 7:45*pm, "Gavino" wrote:
"Buchan Meteo" wrote in message

...

The earth rotates once each day, 365 times in 365 days, and 366 times in
366 days when we add a leap day to the calendar year (not to be confused
with a real year).

No, this is what oriel36 asserts himself and is incorrect.
(He actually has no problem understanding the leap year cycle, quoting ad
nauseam from the ancent Egyptians and other historic sources on the topic..)


The earth rotates once each day *relative to the sun* (that's how we measure
days), but because of its orbit around the sun, the number of rotations in a
year, relative to the stars (which we may regard as a fixed direction in
space) is *one more* than the number of days. See Ian Binghams' post in this
thread.


I will make easy for you all.

When you argue for 1465 rotations in 1461 days you are arguing against
daily rotation keeping in step with daily temperature fluctuations and
that is close to impossible to do.The daily temperature fluctuations
are huge so the inability to assign a cause due to the rotation of the
Earth is an incredibly dum thing in an era convinced that they know
the cause of long terms temperature fluctuations.

The natural noon cycles,of which there are 1461 for years convert to
the 1461 AM/PM's that cross the calendar cycle so the steady
progression of 24 days in a format of 3 years of 365 days and 1 year
of 366 days represent a proportion between rotations and orbital
circuits from the parent fact of 1461 rotations in 4 circuits.

Students or any interested adult inquiring as to where the 1/4 day
goes each year to make up the leap day after every 4th year shouldn't
have to,the system is built on 1461 days and dividing the cycle by 4
circuits equates to 365 1/4 days to one orbital circuit.The 24 hours
of upcoming Feb 29th is being overlaid on the system that the
Egyptians describe and one that everyone here will use today -

The story of the current cycle began on Mar 1st 2008 when daily
rotation and orbital motion started in sync,as the orbital cycle of
the Earth around the Sun is 365 days 5 hours 49 minutes,the orbital
cycle ended at roughly 6 AM Mar 1st 2009 whereupon a new orbital cycle
of 365 1/4 days began and ended at 12 noon Mar 1st 2010,As there are
365 days and rotations between Mar 1st and Feb 28th each year,the
orbital cycle drifts ahead through Mar 1st each non-leap year in
increments of 6 hours so that by Mar 1st 2011,the orbital cycle was
ahead by a full 18 hours in ending at 6 PM Mar 1st 2011.At the end of
Mar 1st 2012 the orbital cycle is ahead by almost a full 24 hours so
that the extra 24 hours of rotation on February 29th returns the daily
and orbital cycles back into sync whereupon the orbital cycle ends the
next year at 6 AM Mar 1st 2013.






So in a four-year cycle of 1461 days, the earth rotates 1465 times about its
own axis. It is this that oriel36 refuses to accept, believing it to be an
abomination, and the sun to be the only true reference point - he even goes
as far as to dismiss Newton's 'gravitational agenda'.


The primary reference is between the two main motions of the Earth and
not to any external object,how many times does the Earth turn for the
same period it takes the Earth to make a complete orbital
circuit ?.The Egyptians used the number of days it took Sirius to
return to the same position in order to maintain a lock between the
number of days and festivals attached to the orbital points of the
equinoxes and solstices and found an extra day was needed hence the
beginning of the 365/366 day format that we still use.

The next reference is natural noon where the natural inequality is
reduced to the equable 24 hour day -

"Draw a Meridian line upon a floor and then hang two plummets, each
by a small thread or wire, directly over the said Meridian, at the
distance of some 2. feet or more one from the other, as the smallness
of the thread will admit. When the middle of the Sun (the Eye being
placed so, as to bring both the threads into one line) appears to be
in the same line exactly.. you are then immediately to set the Watch,
not precisely to the hour of 12. but by so much less, as is the
Aequation of the day by the Table." Huygens

http://adcs.home.xs4all.nl/Huygens/06/kort-E.html

There is a complicated adjustment needed to clear up a few things
however Huygens,as with Harrison,clearly states the primary facts
which all students have a basic right to learn

1 - The Earth has a rotation rate of 15 degrees per hour and turns a
full equatorial circumference of 24901 miles in 24 hours.

2 .The Earth turns 1461 times in 1461 days to the nearest rotation

3 - The pure proportion is 365 1/4 rotations for each time the
planet completes an orbital circuit.



I initially tried to respond to his posts in an attempt to understand what
he was trying to say behind the strange language used.
I now see he's completely deluded and it's pointless trying to convince him
of anything as he just regurgitates the same stuff again and again.
It's best just to ignore him from now on.

It took 40 years to correct the Piltdown Man episode and long after
the perpetrator had alerted researchers to the hoax,this is quite
different as the overall structure is within the reasoning
capabilities of all reasoning people and those who can snap out of the
late 17th century attempt to explain daily and orbital motions using a
24 hour clock.They basically took the 24 hour average which is
generated from natural noon and turned it against the very system from
which it emerged and while I concede the error is not immediately
discernible and there are a tsunami of time abbreviations surrounding
the core error,people who understand even the basics of the leap day
correction on Feb 29th as the 1461st day and rotation that closes out
4 years and 4 orbital circuits of the Earth will begin to undo the
damage,if not here then somewhere else.

So when the temperatures goes down and up within a 24 hour
period,readers can safely interpret it as the rotation of our planet,I
didn't think I would have to explain this to a forum built around
weather and the daily heat and cold but with an idea of 1465 rotations
in 1461 days the loss of cause should anger people who value their
intelligence and accept the only common sense correspondence in 1461
rotations in 1461 days.

"Joe Egginton" wrote in message
...
Actually it's not quite correct to
say that the Earth rotates on its axis every 24 hours - it's 23 hours
and 56 minutes, and the 4 minutes makes it up to 24 hours.

Ian Bingham,
Inchmarlo, Aberdeenshire.

The obvious solution is to shorten the definition of a second from it's
9,162,613,770 oscillations per second of caesium 133. So that the
measurement of the earth's rotation in a day exactly equals 24 hours.

Of course, by changing the definition of a second, it'll have major
implications for our high tech electronic world, from mobile phones to
the internet not working.

To say nothing of the fact that after six months, we would be having solar
noon at midnight!

You *are* joking, I hope?

On Jan 23, 8:07*pm, Joe Egginton wrote:
Actually it's not quite correct to

say that the Earth rotates on its axis every 24 hours - it's 23 hours
and 56 minutes, and the 4 minutes makes it up to 24 hours.

Ian Bingham,
Inchmarlo, Aberdeenshire.

The obvious solution is to shorten the definition of a second from it's
9,162,613,770 oscillations per second of caesium 133. *So that the
measurement of the earth's rotation in a day exactly equals 24 hours.

Of course, by changing the definition of a second, it'll have major
implications for our high tech electronic world, from mobile phones to
the internet not working.

Joe Egginton
Wolverhampton
175m ASL

The original conclusion in 1677 using pendulum clocks led to the
belief in 1465 rotations in 1461 days so you must find a way to undo
the connection between daily temperature rises and falls and daily
rotation as a cause before you comment on anything else.

"... our clocks kept so good a correspondence with the Heavens that I
doubt it not but they would prove the revolutions of the Earth to be
isochronical (equable/constant)" John Flamsteed ,1677

Flamsteed was making his determination using the average 24 hour day
in the human devised calendar format which has a steady progression of
24 hour days in format of 3 years of 365 days and 1 year of 366
days.This is why trying to bridge the 3 minute 56 second gap to
natural noon never works as there is no equable natural noon cycle of
24 hours.

This issue is discussing the primary weather fact before any other
input - Why does it get cold at night and warm during the day and you
can't answer it with 1465 rotations in 1461 days.The guys with their
heads stuck in gadgets might not care but some people who actually
wake up in the morning to a sunrise and know it the Earth's rotation
causing that spectacle may care.