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uk.sci.weather (UK Weather) (uk.sci.weather) For the discussion of daily weather events, chiefly affecting the UK and adjacent parts of Europe, both past and predicted. The discussion is open to all, but contributions on a practical scientific level are encouraged. |
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#1
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Just wondering whether the situation over the last week or so, with
persistent easterlies and Atlantic fronts trying to push in from the west, getting blocked then stalling and retreating again, is in any way similar to the situation which brought heavy snowfalls in the 1946/7 winter. It seems to me that frontal lows coming up against a cold airmass but without a breakdown of the block is the recipe for the heaviest snowfall events historically in the UK. Am I correct here? Someone has already posted elsewhere another of my thoughts that if this stubborn block we have had this month had formed at, say, the end of December, whether the cold would approach that of the 1962/3 winter. If we are getting reports of ice days at the end of March, heaven knows what the temperatures would be like if the same block had formed two or three months ago. Pre-2008, I had wondered just what it takes to get a big snow event in the UK, now I am getting the idea. |
#2
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In article ,
Adam Lea writes: Just wondering whether the situation over the last week or so, with persistent easterlies and Atlantic fronts trying to push in from the west, getting blocked then stalling and retreating again, is in any way similar to the situation which brought heavy snowfalls in the 1946/7 winter. It seems to me that frontal lows coming up against a cold airmass but without a breakdown of the block is the recipe for the heaviest snowfall events historically in the UK. Am I correct here? Many of them, certainly. Someone has already posted elsewhere another of my thoughts that if this stubborn block we have had this month had formed at, say, the end of December, whether the cold would approach that of the 1962/3 winter. If we are getting reports of ice days at the end of March, heaven knows what the temperatures would be like if the same block had formed two or three months ago. I imagine we'd have seen maxima quite widely around -3 to -5C, and perhaps a bit lower still in some places on the coldest days. Looking at the temperatures recorded in February 1947 might give an idea. I've been surprised at just how cold the UK has been in recent weeks, given that temperatures upwind on the near Continent have been little lower if at all. Pre-2008, I had wondered just what it takes to get a big snow event in the UK, now I am getting the idea. ![]() -- John Hall "Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands and all you can do is scratch it." Sir Thomas Beecham (1879-1961) to a lady cellist |
#3
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On 27/03/2013 20:25, John Hall wrote:
In article , Adam Lea writes: Just wondering whether the situation over the last week or so, with persistent easterlies and Atlantic fronts trying to push in from the west, getting blocked then stalling and retreating again, is in any way similar to the situation which brought heavy snowfalls in the 1946/7 winter. It seems to me that frontal lows coming up against a cold airmass but without a breakdown of the block is the recipe for the heaviest snowfall events historically in the UK. Am I correct here? Many of them, certainly. Someone has already posted elsewhere another of my thoughts that if this stubborn block we have had this month had formed at, say, the end of December, whether the cold would approach that of the 1962/3 winter. If we are getting reports of ice days at the end of March, heaven knows what the temperatures would be like if the same block had formed two or three months ago. I imagine we'd have seen maxima quite widely around -3 to -5C, and perhaps a bit lower still in some places on the coldest days. Looking at the temperatures recorded in February 1947 might give an idea. I've been surprised at just how cold the UK has been in recent weeks, given that temperatures upwind on the near Continent have been little lower if at all. Pre-2008, I had wondered just what it takes to get a big snow event in the UK, now I am getting the idea. ![]() Having suffered the curse of Thunderbird yet again I hope this gets through to the group My original reply, which went directly to Adam, was that, in essence, the set ups were similar with fronts stalling as they attempted to progress north-eastwards. However the 1947 winter saw a change from an easterly regime in the first part to a more northerly one in the latter stages as the controlling high pressure shifted westwards. I also mentioned this website, www.winter1947.co.uk -- George in Epping, west Essex, 350'asl www.eppingweather.co.uk www.winter1947.co.uk |
#4
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On 27/03/2013 20:43, George Booth wrote:
On 27/03/2013 20:25, John Hall wrote: In article , Adam Lea writes: Just wondering whether the situation over the last week or so, with persistent easterlies and Atlantic fronts trying to push in from the west, getting blocked then stalling and retreating again, is in any way similar to the situation which brought heavy snowfalls in the 1946/7 winter. It seems to me that frontal lows coming up against a cold airmass but without a breakdown of the block is the recipe for the heaviest snowfall events historically in the UK. Am I correct here? Many of them, certainly. Someone has already posted elsewhere another of my thoughts that if this stubborn block we have had this month had formed at, say, the end of December, whether the cold would approach that of the 1962/3 winter. If we are getting reports of ice days at the end of March, heaven knows what the temperatures would be like if the same block had formed two or three months ago. I imagine we'd have seen maxima quite widely around -3 to -5C, and perhaps a bit lower still in some places on the coldest days. Looking at the temperatures recorded in February 1947 might give an idea. I've been surprised at just how cold the UK has been in recent weeks, given that temperatures upwind on the near Continent have been little lower if at all. Pre-2008, I had wondered just what it takes to get a big snow event in the UK, now I am getting the idea. ![]() Having suffered the curse of Thunderbird yet again I hope this gets through to the group My original reply, which went directly to Adam, was that, in essence, the set ups were similar with fronts stalling as they attempted to progress north-eastwards. However the 1947 winter saw a change from an easterly regime in the first part to a more northerly one in the latter stages as the controlling high pressure shifted westwards. I also mentioned this website, www.winter1947.co.uk Followup George not reply. It's caught me out a few times! Joe Wolverhampton. |
#5
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On 27/03/2013 22:10, Joe Egginton wrote:
On 27/03/2013 20:43, George Booth wrote: On 27/03/2013 20:25, John Hall wrote: In article , Adam Lea writes: Just wondering whether the situation over the last week or so, with persistent easterlies and Atlantic fronts trying to push in from the west, getting blocked then stalling and retreating again, is in any way similar to the situation which brought heavy snowfalls in the 1946/7 winter. It seems to me that frontal lows coming up against a cold airmass but without a breakdown of the block is the recipe for the heaviest snowfall events historically in the UK. Am I correct here? Many of them, certainly. Someone has already posted elsewhere another of my thoughts that if this stubborn block we have had this month had formed at, say, the end of December, whether the cold would approach that of the 1962/3 winter. If we are getting reports of ice days at the end of March, heaven knows what the temperatures would be like if the same block had formed two or three months ago. I imagine we'd have seen maxima quite widely around -3 to -5C, and perhaps a bit lower still in some places on the coldest days. Looking at the temperatures recorded in February 1947 might give an idea. I've been surprised at just how cold the UK has been in recent weeks, given that temperatures upwind on the near Continent have been little lower if at all. Pre-2008, I had wondered just what it takes to get a big snow event in the UK, now I am getting the idea. ![]() Having suffered the curse of Thunderbird yet again I hope this gets through to the group My original reply, which went directly to Adam, was that, in essence, the set ups were similar with fronts stalling as they attempted to progress north-eastwards. However the 1947 winter saw a change from an easterly regime in the first part to a more northerly one in the latter stages as the controlling high pressure shifted westwards. I also mentioned this website, www.winter1947.co.uk Followup George not reply. It's caught me out a few times! Joe Wolverhampton. Thanks Joe. Reassuring to know I am not alone with this irritating aspect of an otherwise OK bit of software. -- George in Epping, west Essex, 350'asl www.eppingweather.co.uk www.winter1947.co.uk |
#6
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John Hall wrote:
In article , Adam Lea writes: Just wondering whether the situation over the last week or so, with persistent easterlies and Atlantic fronts trying to push in from the west, getting blocked then stalling and retreating again, is in any way similar to the situation which brought heavy snowfalls in the 1946/7 winter. It seems to me that frontal lows coming up against a cold airmass but without a breakdown of the block is the recipe for the heaviest snowfall events historically in the UK. Am I correct here? Many of them, certainly. Someone has already posted elsewhere another of my thoughts that if this stubborn block we have had this month had formed at, say, the end of December, whether the cold would approach that of the 1962/3 winter. If we are getting reports of ice days at the end of March, heaven knows what the temperatures would be like if the same block had formed two or three months ago. I imagine we'd have seen maxima quite widely around -3 to -5C, and perhaps a bit lower still in some places on the coldest days. Looking at the temperatures recorded in February 1947 might give an idea. I've been surprised at just how cold the UK has been in recent weeks, given that temperatures upwind on the near Continent have been little lower if at all. Pre-2008, I had wondered just what it takes to get a big snow event in the UK, now I am getting the idea. ![]() ----------------------------------------- I was wondering if such a stable block would/could have formed Dec-Feb in the current times? No real reason not to but our recent cold spells have had a lot of LP about them and perhaps this type of block would have been less stable with the warmer seas then? To me this is the most notable block of it's type for many years and I include the December 2010 notable spell in that. Despite going off cold weather a bit as I get older I would like to see just one more 1947/63 to see how people really would react although I suspect Ken (at Copley) can probably tell me anyway based in this winter!! Dave |
#7
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In article ,
George Booth writes: On 27/03/2013 22:10, Joe Egginton wrote: Followup George not reply. It's caught me out a few times! Thanks Joe. Reassuring to know I am not alone with this irritating aspect of an otherwise OK bit of software. I think that back in the "old days" those were the standard definitions of "follow-up" and "reply". Turnpike, which is my own newsreader, uses them the same way. But if you hit Reply instead of Follow-up, Turnpike does at least give you a warning message and ask if you're sure. -- John Hall "Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands and all you can do is scratch it." Sir Thomas Beecham (1879-1961) to a lady cellist |
#8
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In article ,
Dave Cornwell writes: I was wondering if such a stable block would/could have formed Dec-Feb in the current times? No real reason not to but our recent cold spells have had a lot of LP about them and perhaps this type of block would have been less stable with the warmer seas then? I think prolonged spells of blocking have always been much more common in late winter through to spring than they are earlier in the winter. When I say "always", I should perhaps qualify that as "at least since about the middle of the 20th century and possibly earlier". I say that because the exceptional number of Februaries since then with a sub-zero CET (1947, 1956, 1963, 1986) indicate months where there was almost certainly exceptionally prolonged blocking. -- John Hall "Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands and all you can do is scratch it." Sir Thomas Beecham (1879-1961) to a lady cellist |
#9
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On Thu, 28 Mar 2013 10:06:18 +0000
John Hall wrote: In article , George Booth writes: On 27/03/2013 22:10, Joe Egginton wrote: Followup George not reply. It's caught me out a few times! Thanks Joe. Reassuring to know I am not alone with this irritating aspect of an otherwise OK bit of software. I think that back in the "old days" those were the standard definitions of "follow-up" and "reply". Turnpike, which is my own newsreader, uses them the same way. But if you hit Reply instead of Follow-up, Turnpike does at least give you a warning message and ask if you're sure. In Claws Mail, the 'reply' button means 'reply to message' whilst 'sender' is used for replies to - um - sender. In Pan newsreader, the problem doesn't arise because it doesn't do anything apart from deal with NNTP. I gave up on Thunderbird because it occasionally lost a few filed e-mails after compacting the folders. I noticed a report that a similar fault occurs with MS. It seems the problem is associated with mbox storage - which both use - and the solution advocated for MS users is to only compact folders when offline. I suppose I could have tried that with TB but I was sure I'd forget to do it now and again and lose some more mails. Claws stores mails as files rather than in mbox format so I feel more secure now. -- Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Carlos Seixas, Sonata nÂș 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXox7vonfEg And for something completely different, Cumberland Gap: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsU-LTwx8Co |
#10
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On 28/03/2013 11:01, Graham P Davis wrote:
On Thu, 28 Mar 2013 10:06:18 +0000 John Hall wrote: In article , George Booth writes: On 27/03/2013 22:10, Joe Egginton wrote: Followup George not reply. It's caught me out a few times! Thanks Joe. Reassuring to know I am not alone with this irritating aspect of an otherwise OK bit of software. I think that back in the "old days" those were the standard definitions of "follow-up" and "reply". Turnpike, which is my own newsreader, uses them the same way. But if you hit Reply instead of Follow-up, Turnpike does at least give you a warning message and ask if you're sure. In Claws Mail, the 'reply' button means 'reply to message' whilst 'sender' is used for replies to - um - sender. In Pan newsreader, the problem doesn't arise because it doesn't do anything apart from deal with NNTP. I gave up on Thunderbird because it occasionally lost a few filed e-mails after compacting the folders. I noticed a report that a similar fault occurs with MS. It seems the problem is associated with mbox storage - which both use - and the solution advocated for MS users is to only compact folders when offline. I suppose I could have tried that with TB but I was sure I'd forget to do it now and again and lose some more mails. Claws stores mails as files rather than in mbox format so I feel more secure now. Thanks for the helpful replies. I must admit I'd never given the Thunderbird 'followup' button a second glance. Following Joe's reply I did press it and lo and behold the newsgroup address appears. Many years ago I used Turnpike, didn't realise it was still around. Outlook Express gave many years of reliable service but once Win7 appeared things were not so good and I moved over to Thunderbird. I also find that Virginmedia's spam filters are now so efficient that I have to check the spam folder on their servers for any mail messages wrongly judged to be unacceptable. I regularly find OK messages nestling amongst all the nonsense. Another Usenet puzzle is that there are some regular posters on here whose messages I never see except on Google. These folks are not on the small killfile list but something, somewhere is filtering them out. Still cold here, early morning clear skies gone, just a few patches of frozen snow left. Maybe time to wash 900 miles worth of salt off the car. -- George in Epping, west Essex, 350'asl www.eppingweather.co.uk www.winter1947.co.uk |
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