On Wednesday, 24 September 2014 22:12:23 UTC+1, Alastair wrote:
"Graham P Davis" wrote in message

news:20140923105016.6c2a27be@linux-omey...

On Tue, 23 Sep 2014 10:31:06 +0100

Joe Egginton wrote:



On 23/09/2014 08:52, Graham P Davis wrote:

Although _scientific_ discussion of climate change has long been

allowed for in this group's constitution, I realise that some

people are bored by it and that is why I prefix the title with

"[CC]" in the same way that "[WR]" and "[OBS]" were introduced so

that such threads could be filtered out by uninterested parties.



Any road up, here's the link:



http://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/20...nimum-reached/





WHY is the arctic shrinking and the antarctic growing?



It's getting warmer.



Arctic sea and land ice is melting. Any fresh water from melting land

ice is quickly lost from the area, carried south and mixed with

warmer, saline water.



Antarctic land ice is melting. Increased fresh water largely remains

within Antarctic waters, circling eastwards, making formation of sea-ice

easier.



Having just sent my previous post, I then read this about the increasing

sea ice around Antarctica:



"Factors like increasing fresh water and higher wind speeds promote ice

growth and expansion-factors that appear to be dominating right now."

http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/IOT...8&src=eoa-iotd



So it is both fresh water and more storms that is causing the sea ice to

increase..



Cheers, Alastair.



Really?

http://d32ogoqmya1dw8.cloudfront.net...g_salinity.gif

On Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:46:50 PM UTC+1, Lawrence Jenkins wrote:

The same experts........

Errrrr actually no. There are just an awful lot of research scientists people that know a lot more than you do.

You see you *believe* it's "the same experts", because to you "experts" are all the same. People that don't believe what you do, so you somehow try to lump them into a larry "experts" bin.

It's just so funny reading what you say. You are being laughed at *again* for the abject lack of knowledge which fuels your belief system. Even you must see that.

On Wednesday, September 24, 2014 10:07:12 PM UTC+1, Lawrence Jenkins wrote:
On Wednesday, 24 September 2014 20:19:59 UTC+1, Stephen Davenport wrote:

1. "Large Multidecadal Salinity Trends near the Pacific–Antarctic Continental Margin"







Stanley S. Jacobs and Claudia F. Giulivi



Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory, Columbia University, Palisades, New York.







http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/full...2010JCLI3284.1







"Ocean temperature and salinity measurements on and near the Antarctic continental shelf in the southwest Pacific sector are evaluated for evidence of temporal change.







Shelf water in the southwest Ross Sea has declined in salinity by 0.03 decade−1 from 1958 to 2008, while its temperatures have increased in



proportion to the influence of salinity on the sea surface freezing point.







Modified deep-water intrusions that reach the central Ross Ice Shelf have freshened at a similar rate and cooled by ∼0.5°C since the late 1970s. Salinity has decreased by 0.08 decade−1 in the westward coastal and slope front currents, consistent with increased melting of continental ice upstream in the Amundsen Sea."







Further reading:







2. "Rapid sea-level rise along the Antarctic margins in response to increased glacial discharge".







Craig D. Rye, Alberto C. Naveira Garabato, Paul R. Holland, Michael P. Meredith, A. J. George Nurser, Chris W. Hughes, Andrew C. Coward & David J. Webb.







http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v.../ngeo2230.html







"The Antarctic shelf seas are [...] at present receiving increasing amounts of freshwater from the melting of the Antarctic Ice Sheet and its fringing ice shelves, primarily around the Antarctic Peninsula and the Amundsen Sea. In response, the surface ocean salinity in this region has declined in past decades".







A few citations:







Shepherd, A. et al. A reconciled estimate of ice-sheet mass balance. Science 338, 1183–1189 (2012). http://www.sciencemag.org/content/338/6111/1183







Shepherd, A., Wingham, D. & Rignot, E. Warm ocean is eroding West Antarctic Ice Sheet. Geophys. Res. Lett. 31, L23402 (2004). http://onlinelibrary..wiley.com/doi/...21106/abstract







Jacobs, S. S., Giulivi, C. F. & Mele, P. A. Freshening of the Ross Sea during the late 20th century. Science 297, 386–389 (2002). http://www.sciencemag.org/content/297/5580/386







Aoki, S., Rintoul, S. R., Ushio, S., Watanabe, S. & Bindoff, N. L. Freshening of the Adélie Land bottom water near 140° E. Geophys. Res. Lett. 32, L23601 (2005). http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...24246/abstract







Johnson, G. C., Purkey, S. G. & Bullister, J. L. Warming and freshening in the abyssal Southeastern Indian Ocean*. J. Clim. 21, 5351–5363 (2008). http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/abs/...2008JCLI2384.1











---------------











I'd have thought that you'd have stepped away from trying sensibly to discuss anything to do with Earth sciences after your lamentable efforts on a previous thread.







But just for a laugh, what "other source" do you think there is for fresh water in the Antarctic-Pacific margin?







Stephen.





Okay then Stephen am I reading this chart correctly



http://d32ogoqmya1dw8.cloudfront.net...g_salinity.gif



It shows global ocean salinity and from what I can sea that there if far more fresh water in the arctic oceans than the Antarctic oceans which is odd as the Arctic if based on the latest lower salinity theory should show far more sea ice growth than the Antarctic which has far higher salinity.



Is there another explanation?

In a hole.......digging deeper.........please stop, the laughter is hurting my sides!

In article ,
says...

Is there another explanation?

In a hole.......digging deeper.........please stop, the laughter is hurting my sides!


For one that insists that others answer questions, you appear quite
adept at avoiding them yourself.

236 lines, just to add 1 more. -sigh-


--
Alan LeHun
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