On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 7:32:06 AM UTC+1, Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
On Sat, 12 Sep 2015 23:06:28 +0100, Joe Egginton wrote:

In affectionate remembrance of the Labour Party, which died at the Queen
Elizabeth II conference centre, Westminster, on 12 September, 2015......

Lifted, withouit acknowledgement, from the Daily Telegraph.

Well there's a surprise.
You can tell it wasn't Crazy Joe as it was actually coherently written and didn't contain any spelling mistakes.

Col

On 13/09/2015 16:08, wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 7:32:06 AM UTC+1, Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
On Sat, 12 Sep 2015 23:06:28 +0100, Joe Egginton wrote:

In affectionate remembrance of the Labour Party, which died at the Queen
Elizabeth II conference centre, Westminster, on 12 September, 2015......

Lifted, withouit acknowledgement, from the Daily Telegraph.

Well there's a surprise.
You can tell it wasn't Crazy Joe as it was actually coherently written and didn't contain any spelling mistakes.

Col

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I never feel sad when I hear somebody talking about fairness, decency,
kindness, respect. One world, all human beings, peace and no wars.
Yes, idealist. Yes unworkable. But I'm always accused of being an
idealist and sometimes it's nice to know you are not alone in a world
where violence, hatred and bigotry seem to rule, and that there are
others who advocate hope not hate
Dave

On 13/09/2015 22:32, Dave Cornwell wrote:
On 13/09/2015 16:08, wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 7:32:06 AM UTC+1, Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
On Sat, 12 Sep 2015 23:06:28 +0100, Joe Egginton
wrote:

In affectionate remembrance of the Labour Party, which died at the
Queen
Elizabeth II conference centre, Westminster, on 12 September,
2015......

Lifted, withouit acknowledgement, from the Daily Telegraph.

Well there's a surprise.
You can tell it wasn't Crazy Joe as it was actually coherently written
and didn't contain any spelling mistakes.

Col

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I never feel sad when I hear somebody talking about fairness, decency,
kindness, respect. One world, all human beings, peace and no wars.
Yes, idealist. Yes unworkable. But I'm always accused of being an
idealist and sometimes it's nice to know you are not alone in a world
where violence, hatred and bigotry seem to rule, and that there are
others who advocate hope not hate
Dave

Hope not hate, such pious sentiments make me puke! This is the trouble
with left wingers, they live in a fairy tale land, which is why they
rarely get into government , thank God.

---
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On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:04:22 PM UTC+1, jumper wrote:

Hope not hate, such pious sentiments make me puke! This is the trouble
with left wingers, they live in a fairy tale land, which is why they
rarely get into government , thank God.


'Hope not hate' may be something of a cliché but it's sentiment rings true. Nobody is living in a 'fairy tale land' but there is nothing wrong with striving for a perfect world, you might at least end up with a better one.
But all you do is sneer ant such a notion as if wanting a better world is something only those 'woolly minded liberals' would want.

You really are a miserable wretch.

Col

On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 10:32:30 PM UTC+1, Dave Cornwell wrote:
On 13/09/2015 16:08, wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 7:32:06 AM UTC+1, Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
On Sat, 12 Sep 2015 23:06:28 +0100, Joe Egginton wrote:

In affectionate remembrance of the Labour Party, which died at the Queen
Elizabeth II conference centre, Westminster, on 12 September, 2015.......

Lifted, withouit acknowledgement, from the Daily Telegraph.

Well there's a surprise.
You can tell it wasn't Crazy Joe as it was actually coherently written and didn't contain any spelling mistakes.

Col

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I never feel sad when I hear somebody talking about fairness, decency,
kindness, respect. One world, all human beings, peace and no wars.
Yes, idealist. Yes unworkable. But I'm always accused of being an
idealist and sometimes it's nice to know you are not alone in a world
where violence, hatred and bigotry seem to rule, and that there are
others who advocate hope not hate
Dave

Starting to sound like the great John Lennon Dave!

Yes, very refreshing that there's a leader of a major party with genuine beliefs and who cares, makes a welcome change from in the New Labour 'What do I need to say to get into power' mantra.

I'm not an idealistic advocate of public or private ownership, but remember the time when there was 1 number for directory enquiries, it was free and you mostly got the right number. Or there were 4 buses a day to Sennen and you could return on any bus, now you have to wait 6 hours to catch a bus by the same operator or pay again. Or you didn't have to worry about changing power supplier & all the hassle that involves, Or my disabled daughter was provided with services, not given a personal budget where I have to do all the sorting out they used to do and where many privatised 'service providers' have the life expectancy of a hamster. (what happens when I'mm not around), Or . .

I think Jeremy has tapped into a widespread feeling after decades of political selfishness, extreme capitalism, and downright lies.

I don't agree with everything he says, though I'm certainly against spending billions on Trident, both because I think it's wrong and there are so many better uses for the money.

It amuses me that he's accused of being out of touch with the electorate when he gets 60% of the vote and people are flocking to join the labour party.. It just shows the extreme arrogance of the Blairites (and others).

Anyway, enough from me, I know I'll be accused of being an extreme lefty.

Chilly out this morning, could end up the 1st 15C max for 3 months.

Graham
Penzance

On Monday, 14 September 2015 09:22:46 UTC+1, Graham Easterling wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 10:32:30 PM UTC+1, Dave Cornwell wrote:
On 13/09/2015 16:08, wrote:
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 7:32:06 AM UTC+1, Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
On Sat, 12 Sep 2015 23:06:28 +0100, Joe Egginton wrote:

In affectionate remembrance of the Labour Party, which died at the Queen
Elizabeth II conference centre, Westminster, on 12 September, 2015.......

Lifted, withouit acknowledgement, from the Daily Telegraph.

Well there's a surprise.
You can tell it wasn't Crazy Joe as it was actually coherently written and didn't contain any spelling mistakes.

Col

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I never feel sad when I hear somebody talking about fairness, decency,
kindness, respect. One world, all human beings, peace and no wars.
Yes, idealist. Yes unworkable. But I'm always accused of being an
idealist and sometimes it's nice to know you are not alone in a world
where violence, hatred and bigotry seem to rule, and that there are
others who advocate hope not hate
Dave

Starting to sound like the great John Lennon Dave!

Yes, very refreshing that there's a leader of a major party with genuine beliefs and who cares, makes a welcome change from in the New Labour 'What do I need to say to get into power' mantra.

I'm not an idealistic advocate of public or private ownership, but remember the time when there was 1 number for directory enquiries, it was free and you mostly got the right number. Or there were 4 buses a day to Sennen and you could return on any bus, now you have to wait 6 hours to catch a bus by the same operator or pay again. Or you didn't have to worry about changing power supplier & all the hassle that involves, Or my disabled daughter was provided with services, not given a personal budget where I have to do all the sorting out they used to do and where many privatised 'service providers' have the life expectancy of a hamster. (what happens when I'mm not around), Or . .

I think Jeremy has tapped into a widespread feeling after decades of political selfishness, extreme capitalism, and downright lies.

I don't agree with everything he says, though I'm certainly against spending billions on Trident, both because I think it's wrong and there are so many better uses for the money.

It amuses me that he's accused of being out of touch with the electorate when he gets 60% of the vote and people are flocking to join the labour party. It just shows the extreme arrogance of the Blairites (and others).

Anyway, enough from me, I know I'll be accused of being an extreme lefty.

Chilly out this morning, could end up the 1st 15C max for 3 months.

Graham
Penzance

I loved Lennon but I have to say he wasn't so great to his son Julian, all that love he told everyone that they needed was obviously not meant for his son.

In addition: when he sings "imagine no possessions" I can only assume he meant the type that spiritualist mediums and priests exorcize as he couldn't have meant material ones as he was totally loaded with them. He also sang "imagine no religion yet tried almost everyone.


I still forgive him, he was flawed but brilliant at what he did.


Now what was that song where he was going to hunt down that ex girlfriend of his as he'd rather see her dead than to be with another man.

Oh dear, the Guardianistas won't like those sentiments


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZWv4GZiEYA


I read somewhere he was moving towards supporting Ronald Reagan before he was murdered

On 14/09/2015 09:22, Graham Easterling wrote:

[snip]

It amuses me that he's accused of being out of touch with the electorate when he
gets 60% of the vote and people are flocking to join the labour party. It just shows
the extreme arrogance of the Blairites (and others).

The electorate of whom 60% voted for Corbyn numbered 422,664. The
electorate he is said to be out of touch with numbered ~30m in the
General Election.

251,417 voted for Corbyn, but 9.3m voted Labour last May.

49.6% of full Labour Party members voted for Corbyn.
57.6% of Affiliated members (Unions, Co-Ops, etc) did so.
83.8% of Registered Supporters (so called £3 members) did so.

Over 50% of full members voted for other candidates.
Only 48% of affiliates bothered to vote at all.
Only 16% of Registered Supporters voted for other candidates.

I read/heard somewhere, but can't verify that only 14 of the
232 Labour MPs voted for Corbyn.

While 60% is impressive, when you dig into the detail, it's 60%
of not very much.

On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 11:20:59 AM UTC+1, Brian Lawrence wrote:
On 14/09/2015 09:22, Graham Easterling wrote:

[snip]

It amuses me that he's accused of being out of touch with the electorate when he
gets 60% of the vote and people are flocking to join the labour party. It just shows
the extreme arrogance of the Blairites (and others).

The electorate of whom 60% voted for Corbyn numbered 422,664. The
electorate he is said to be out of touch with numbered ~30m in the
General Election.

251,417 voted for Corbyn, but 9.3m voted Labour last May.

49.6% of full Labour Party members voted for Corbyn.
57.6% of Affiliated members (Unions, Co-Ops, etc) did so.
83.8% of Registered Supporters (so called £3 members) did so.

Over 50% of full members voted for other candidates.
Only 48% of affiliates bothered to vote at all.
Only 16% of Registered Supporters voted for other candidates.

I read/heard somewhere, but can't verify that only 14 of the
232 Labour MPs voted for Corbyn.

While 60% is impressive, when you dig into the detail, it's 60%
of not very much.

Fully accept what you say. However 50% of full party members voted for him whilst only 14 Labour MPs did so. This strongly suggests that the majority of current - still basically Blairite - Labour MPs are currently out of touch with their own party members, not Jeremy Corbyn. Also the age of many of his supporters shows that he is not relying on support from older people harking back to some golden era, he has touched upon something valid now.

You point out only 48% of affiliates bothered to vote, but that's actually quite a high figure when you consider the number of people who are members of affiliated organisations and either personally support another party, or who are simply disinterested in politics.

I'm not a labour party member by the way.

Graham
Penzance

On 14/09/2015 12:50, Graham Easterling wrote:
On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 11:20:59 AM UTC+1, Brian Lawrence wrote:
On 14/09/2015 09:22, Graham Easterling wrote:

[snip]

It amuses me that he's accused of being out of touch with the electorate when he
gets 60% of the vote and people are flocking to join the labour party. It just shows
the extreme arrogance of the Blairites (and others).

The electorate of whom 60% voted for Corbyn numbered 422,664. The
electorate he is said to be out of touch with numbered ~30m in the
General Election.

251,417 voted for Corbyn, but 9.3m voted Labour last May.

49.6% of full Labour Party members voted for Corbyn.
57.6% of Affiliated members (Unions, Co-Ops, etc) did so.
83.8% of Registered Supporters (so called £3 members) did so.

Over 50% of full members voted for other candidates.
Only 48% of affiliates bothered to vote at all.
Only 16% of Registered Supporters voted for other candidates.

I read/heard somewhere, but can't verify that only 14 of the
232 Labour MPs voted for Corbyn.

While 60% is impressive, when you dig into the detail, it's 60%
of not very much.

Fully accept what you say. However 50% of full party members voted for him whilst only 14 Labour MPs did so. This strongly suggests that the majority of current - still basically Blairite - Labour MPs are currently out of touch with their own party members, not Jeremy Corbyn. Also the age of many of his supporters shows that he is not relying on support from older people harking back to some golden era, he has touched upon something valid now.

You point out only 48% of affiliates bothered to vote, but that's actually quite a high figure when you consider the number of people who are members of affiliated organisations and either personally support another party, or who are simply disinterested in politics.

I'm not a labour party member by the way.

Nor me.

Apologies for continuing OT, but I intended to add to the previous post
- back in the 2010 leadership contest:

126,874 full members voted
211,234 affiliates voted
266 MPs & MEPs voted

Those three each contributed 33% to the overall result.
The equivalent numbers in 2015 we

245,520 full members (+118,646)
71,546 affiliates (-139,688)

MPs & MEPs presumably included in 2015 full members number.

Number of affiliates voting has fallen by ~66% since 2010, but I don't
know how many were eligible in 2010. The total number eligible to vote
in 2015 was 147,134.

On 14/09/2015 09:22, Graham Easterling wrote:
Chilly out this morning, could end up the 1st 15C max for 3 months.

The first autumnal feeling day after a lovely 'still-like-summer' weekend.

A maximum of 15.5C making it the coldest day maximum since 14.0C on the
1st June.

[OT] Ken Clarke reckons Jeremy Corbyn will be the next Prime Minister.

Privatisation of all the utility companies is needed. At the moment we
have EDF which is a state owned French company supplying electricity,
not for the goodness of its French heart but to make lots of money out
of us. A proportion of the profits from British bill payers are going
into the French government's coffers. This also applies to the myriad of
other foreign owned utilities where profit made from UK bill payers is
going abroad and aiding the exchequers financies in other countries.

I think Christian Wolmar, a rail industry analyst sums it up nicely: “It
is a completely daft situation where state-run companies in foreign
countries can bid for our rail services but UK ones can’t. It is
specifically banned by law for the likes of Transport for London, or
Directly Operated Railways to bid for UK rail contracts.”

Methinks that applies to some of our other utilities too....

--
Nick Gardner
Otter Valley, Devon
20 m amsl
http://www.ottervalley.co.uk